Can anybody inform me about ways/methods to learn about aero modelling. I have seen there is one option through aero-sports.in, but it's very expensive.

Please let me have some easy options.

Gauti, your question is already answered in the topic RC INDIA GEMS, on welcome page, and you must read all topics there one by one, patiently, and follow the instructions from there.. and yes, please do not jump in to one, as you read, but read a lots and go for a final judgement, of you, yourselves, that about how much money that you can spent, nature and vastness of your flying ground, and rate of your personal interests..

but still giving you some basic tips..at first we must say thank to God, for the present ooportunity, to make and fly the RC planes..because, at present, we are living in a fortunate era, of aero modelling, because of the ease of avilability of needed materials and helps..

to becom a good RC flyer, you do not need any extra expensive stuffs..the term aeromodelling goes in to these catagories..as,
Static Scale models:- making and displaying static models of aeroplanes and others from a kit, or from scaratch building..

Free flight models:-these are aero models are intended for free flights..is means, you can simply make the model and can throw with your hands, after balancing it..you can also catapult it..

Roopesh: Golden Words of Wisdom

Gauti, like the Nike Ad says, "JUST DO IT"

the next segment is rubber band powered models..these are marvels, and can launch model with wound rubber bands with a prop..but will give you only a short time, and yes in some models, especially in some competition models, we can find a long running, that achieved by extra ordinary rubberbands with a extra ordinary nature..its fun to fly it..

next segment is Control Line models..up to rubber powered models, we saw nothing on it to control the models..ita all free flights..here, we have two cables coming out of the aircraft wing, is to control the elevator surface once..will be equpped with a IC engine, ( internal combustion engine , using fuels), or by an ECM, ( electronically commutated motor), known as brushless, or with an MCM, (mechanically commutaed motor), or brushed motor, will circles around you, while you holds the control line cables in your hands..this is a very popular sport all over the world..

Good morning Sir..and hope my efforts helps the beginners..

the final version is the most versatile of all..the real flight, with a wireless controller..to control an Aircraft, or any model, we do not need a real Radio wave..but also can use, sound, light and temperature..etc..but, most versatile option is Radio waves..so, nowadays, it is very easy to buy a radio set, as it costs very less than a mobile phone..so, to enter in to RC flying, you must buy a radio system, with 4 micro servos.. the radio must be a basic 4 channel one, with servo reversing switch in front panel..and also must be with analog trimmers for servo centering..many of us, will scratches our head while reading my request, about a 4 channel basic radio..but, i strongly recommend to buy a 4 channel basic radio, because it is the best option for a beginner..if you realize that the elevator is connected in wrong direction, you can simply make it correct with flipping the switch on panel..click..its ok..and with analog trimmers you can correct the attitude of the flight in seconds, while looking on to your models, while not looking in to LCD screens of TX for corrections..
and, you are liable to spend at least 14000/-Rs on an expensive radio system..instead, plaese buy a basic 4 channel, and one 6 channel, both costs within a 5000/-Rs now..so, can use the 4 channel for beginning, and can use the 6 as you advances..these radios are capable of multiple mixing include 120 degree swash mixes..!!

means, you got two radio sets about Rs 5000/-...
now the servos..you can buy micro servos, about Rs 200 /- each, and a 9 gram do the job nicely..you can also buy standard servos, that if you are using a big plane with big control surfaces..but, here it is not nessesary to buy standard servos, as it weighs more..

now, time to choose powerplant..  choosing powerplant is all according to you..it falls in two catagory..as,

IC engines, ( internal combustion engines, that uses fuels), and
Electric motors, ( that uses electric current from battery)..

whilke using IC engines, you must need a clear knowledge about IC engines..it starts from fuelling the tank, priming, running in, tuning, starting set ups, carb settings, prop selections etc..IC engines takes a good rate of maintenance, as cleaning, decarbonizing etc..as periodically..but gives us enormous power untill fuel runs out..

while using Electric motors, it is very easy that you do not have any more maintenace on it..just plug it..and fly it..

so, an electric option is a far better option for a beginner..so, some other criterias..how to choose a motor, and a prop for it, while thinking about the battery and ESC..
so, the electric flight under considerations..
it consists an Electric motor, to drive a propultion to generate thrust force to propel the plane through the sky..
a propeller, that spinned by the motor, must be capable to generate enough thrust for a given value, while without over heating the motor..
an ESC, (electronic speed controller for motor) that controls motor, according to TX input..
and a battery pack..that must be capable of delivering the needed power to your aircraft..

then please do not burn your brain a lots, while thinking about the needed set ups, as i am giving you very proven set up for a beginner and as for an expert..really what we need..?

here we are..
1)  BRUSHLESS MOTOR : 1000 RPM /Volt,you can choose any brand, as most of them are coming from same origin..except stickers..costs 550/- Rs
2) an ESC for the motor, rated at 30 Amps..500/-Rs
3) PROPELLER.. 9X6 means, 9 inch dia, and 6 pitch..costs 80 Rs /- for a good strong one..
4) three MICRO SERVOS..costs 600/-Rs
5) Battery pack of LiPoly.. 1200 mAh.. costs about 1000/-Rs

so, even with a 4 or 6 channel radio, you spends about less than a 5000/-Rs..a good deal than buying a mobile phone..so, we got all needed materials..then plane..? it is very easy to make aplane your own..all costs about 200 Rs..with a wingspan of 48 inches..do not think more about its nature aerofoil etc..make a simple plane and with a slender aerofoil, that can make simply with coro sheets...here an example..

it flies like a dream..and levels a lots itself..and we do not spent thousands of Rupees on a plane while starting..if this one crash, how much will be lost..? and suppose your motor burns off..so, what..? rewind it within a 30 minutes and back..buy two batteries instead of one..so, can avoid desperation as battery empties fast while learing to fly..and can fly in a very low throttle, as plane glides through air, as its stall threshold is too low..make it..fly it..again..and again..its too light in weight..choose early moring as just on sunrise, so will get a calm sky to fly and learn..as you advances you can make 3D planes like this, with powerful motor and props..

it is too hard to know that about a hitten motor..with bend shafts..so, for a beginner, a pusher will be nice..that you can make a simple plane, while fixing the motor on it, in such a way, that motor prop pushes the plane instead of pulling..this saves the all electronics, especially motor and prop in a crash..here is one example of my test bed pusher..i made it to study and research about the nature of various aerofoils, and configurations..its simpe..but elegant..

so..be at ease..collect..
A 4 channel basic radio set with servo reverse switches in panel.. Rs 2500/-
A brushless motor of rated 1000kV------------------------------ Rs   550/-
An ESC at 30 Amps -------------------------------------------- Rs   500/-
a Prop at 9X6 --------------------------------------------------Rs     80/-
a Li Poly battery pack in to 1200 mAh----------------------------Rs 1200/-
3 Micro servos--------------------------------------------------Rs   600/-
Coro sheet to make a plane-------------------------------------Rs    100/-
Glue, wheels bicycle spokes to make landing gear all -------------Rs     200/-
                                                                        total about       5730/-...
so, we need a 6000 Rs to get in our hobby..(to me making model is not hobby..but its my life..)

so, dont be lazy..please do not think big big things..start simply..follow..steps up..advance..and be in a sheer pleassure of pure RCying...because all we wre RC INDIANS..Friends..

HI Roopesh,
Thanks for the much detailed and helpful information. 
I have already purchased one model from rcbazaar and I am trying my hand on that. But, this basic model iteslf is very costly i.e. it doesnt seems like worth Rs1100/- which I payed for it. I just need to undersrand, in order to create basic model, do we have any company in India, who sell these stuff at much economical price. Looking at the price of Rs1100/- and same product on internet is available at USD12 in US i.e. the major cost is just for duties and profits.

Is there any indegenised concept ,

Thanks again

thumbs up

Wonderful advice from Roopesh!

I have a slightly different view here. Instead of going the building way, I feel it's best to get a proven and sturdy pusher model like Sky surfer or Easy Star. You pay a little more but I'll tell you, it's worth every single rupee. There is no trial and error and they are very very stable and strong. Of course, you need to spend a few sessions on the simulator to learn some basics so you cause minimum damage to the model while learning. I have crashed my sky surfer couple of times, but could easily restore it.

If a guide is available then it's great. You just get their help for take off and landing.

This is from my experience because I too tried the building way but realized that I was spending more time building and rectifying things than actually flying.

Vishal..its great..and this is already answered by me.. that if you have enough money to buy readymade machines it will be a good thing.. but, as a modeller what will be our contribution here..? and i wonder, while looking in to price lists from Hobby shops, because 100% needed stuffs are far " i never tell it as cheap" but less expensive..but value for money.. and just like rewinding a brushless all we never think, that making our own crafts is not going to fly..!!  and it is just like learning to ride a bicycle..for a beginner riding a bicycle will be a nightmare as he loses his balance and falls instantly..and after learning, to ride, he will be on bicycle with his one lug, on a pedal, while riding, and his hands may off from handle bar..like that, if you are a person with a clear idea about RC flying then no matter its a RTF or self made..its all falls on matter of debate and money in your hand..anyhow, anyone can enter in the magnificent hobby of RCying in a very low budged today..i praises God once again, as in my beginning years before, i still remember that i stands in front of the India Hobby Centre, just like a hungry cat, looking in to a meat shop, while mouthful of water, that realizes that with the money in my hand, cant buy even a servo.. because on that time a micro servo was rated as 2700/-Rs.. but today all we are much much fortunate of buying , making and RCying our crafts.. and one more, many Hobby shops holds very good models with them, for a very reasonable price..can buy and try.. but making our own plane with own colour scheme is different experience.. anyway, today is the great day to start RC flying, by own made or by RTF..so, dont be lazy anymore..come in..all are invited.. and be in pure pleassure of RCyinnnnnnnnnggggg..........  be RC INDIANS.. have nice flights all..

Gauti..will add a detailed building log with diagrams of a slow beginner aircraft, that is proven..no trial and error trying if you made it correct.. can try once..

I whole heartedly appreciate your views Roopesh

And yes, you are right in every way that we are indeed very fortunate now to have everything at our disposal at reasonable prices.

Cheers  

have nice RCYiinnnnnnnnngggggggggggg.........

Yes, that is a good way to start. But, nothing gives you more joy than flying something you've built with your own hands. I'm sure Roopesh sir would agree! 

It takes time to learn building (took me a little more than a year), but then on you can build a SPAD in 2-3 hours!

Yes..Swapnil..once mastered..its all easy.. 

yes, yes... my first spad took me a month to build.... i made 5 models all went to waste... the models i made afterwards took lesser time but were better in quality... now my 6th edition avispad is all set to fly...
just no time for maiden... then i will decorate it.

to start aeromodelling i spent rupees zero...
I stole coro from gates and electricity poles...
then i went to a shop which sold coro...
i asked him for the price of a coro sheet
he asked me why..
i told him i made planes out of them...
he was kind so he gave me 2 3ftx3ft sheets for free...

sir,is there any coro trainer available in market under rs 1000?

If you ask someone who started this hobby by scratch building he will advocate scratch building and the vice versa case for PNF guys.
it all depends on the perception, nature of person, time that he can spend and resource/ help he has.
I love scratchbuilding. even if it doesnt fly well like a PNF model ill be happy with it, and i learned a lot through scratch building and now i get to know where it went wrong in a model if it shows some sign of failure. and once i feel like i have no time for it, ill buy a model and fly it, but it surely will be boring job.

Ashok.P

@v2 eagle
 
 you are totally right sir   

Thanks Roopeshk ,this is a gem of a info you shared, was struggling to know about servos and props motor bat specs. Great info hats off

Can you pl put more light on higher esc and battery 40,60 amp, can we put them on light weight planes, for longer time.?
Or large power bat( will cost more) and lower esc? 30 amp? Will it work?

Roopeshk ,sanjayrai - do you think following set up should be good enough to start with
(Availability is the critical thing )
(Tx rx not available )

From rc Bharat
   
ZOP Power 2200Mah Lipo--       Rs 1,189   
Specification
Battery Configuration: 11.1V 2200mAh 3cell
Battery Capacity: 2200mAh
Max Continuous Discharge (C-rate/current): 20C
Max Burst (3Sec) (C-rate/current): 45C
Approx Dimensions H x W x L (mm): 22.0 x 35 x 104
Approx Weight (g): 166.5
Max Charging rate: 2C

   
Mystery Pentium 30A Brushless ESC--       Rs 957   
Weight: 28g /0.99 oz
Size: 45X24X9mm
Features:
Constant current 30A Max 40A <10s
Li-Poly 2-3 cells;
Ni-MH 4-10 cells Auto Detect Break On/Off; Progarmmable
BEC: 2A
Auto Low battery Slow down at 3.0V/cell Lipo, cut-off at 2.9V/cell Lipo


Mystery A2212-6 2200KV Brushless Outrunner Motor--       Rs 897   
RPM/V      2200KV
No. Of cells        5-7Ni-MH/2-3Li-Po
Max. efficiency current      14 - 22 A (>72%)
NoLoad current / 10 V        1.4 A
Current capacity        28 A/ 60 s
Max. efficiency          0.75
Shaft diameter (mm) 3 mm
Weight with cables    47 g
Internal Resistance     45 mΩ
Dimensions(mm)       27.5x30
Recomended model weight :300-1000g
Recomended prop without gearbox   2xLi 7"x5",3xLi 5"x5",3xLi - heli
Remarks:   Ideal to work with our 20A ESC and 30A ESC For A2212/6 and A2212/10


Mystery 9grm Analog Metal Gear Servo--       Rs 491   

Size mm 22.8*12.2*28.5
Weight g 13.4g
Stall torque 1.8kg/cm(4.8v) 2.2kg/cm(6.0v)
Operating speed 0.10sec/60degree(4.8v) 0.08sec/60degree(6.0v)
Operating voltage 4.8V
Dead band width 5μs

ES9051 (4.3G) DIGITAL SERVO.      350/-        Kinetic hobby


Direct Drive Prop 8x6--       Rs 48   or

Electric Prop 9x6--       Rs 80   or

9x5 1CW & 1CCW--       Rs 147   or

Slow Fly Propeller 9x4.7 Pair--       Rs 185 ( suggest best)

Control Horns 16x20mm (6pcs)--      @ Rs 10   Rs 58

From rcdhamaka
Charger
V3+ AC240v 2/3s Lipo/Life Charger.        649/-

Still not getting wires and carbon rods.

is control line the best way to get into aeromodelling?

first get any simulator and practice a lot

second if you like to build your own trainer aircraft build aircraft in the weight range of 300 grms

third if you do not like to build then batter you buy sky surfer airplane

finally go with the trainer to get basic of the rc flying or fly in the supervision of senior member


 

@rj varun
For those who can spend about Rs 25,000 the way is to get an ARF and simulator.
For others The best way to learn aeromodelling (as opposed to just flying) is to build a balsa chuck glider
Then build a towline glider like say Mercury Gnome (plan in www.outerzone.co.uk)
This will teach you the basics of how to build/ trim a model.

Then, when you move into RC, you will need
1. TxRx costing 5-10,000
2. Motor, props, ESC, servos, batteries, intelligent charger, total 5-10,000
3. A model known to be a successful trainer, say 2-5,000

I'm afraid control line is now not a very suitable intro to aeromodelling. Too much risk of crash damage.
Control line now must be a special interest.
Now that I've managed to get hold of a non RC OS Pet 0.099, once I find my handle and lines, I will build a CL stunter, and post progress on the forum. My NIB Marvin kit is still in Lucknow.

The real charm of CL is that no RC pilot can do consecutive lazy eights below 30 ft!
(Except a few hot shot 3D pilots)

In CL I could do lazy 8s, horizontal / vertical / overhead 8s, inside/outside consecutive loops, reverse wingover and inverted flight.

Never got the courage to even try squares, triangles, hourglass or cloverleaf!

Attached pic of me flying inverted at Safdarjung about 40 years ago! Not sure if you can see the model.

CL Aerobatics

The only guy I've seen doing squares and triangles is one Mr Ravi Kumar. (Around 1980)

The only guy I've heard of doing Cloverleaves is his late father Mr Suresh Kumar
 (founder owner of India's Hobby Centre / Aurora Models)

Not heard of anyone doing a cloverleaf in India in the last 40-50 years

Come on Ravi/Rishi, talk to us.
There must be thousands of Indians who owe their aeromodelling to your dad.

Don't you remember John (and me, Krishnan in those days, with my blue monokote OS20 powered Peacemaker, or my black Gnobler, or my releasable towhook / split rudder airbrake RC Glider around 1975-85)?
I was even on the cover of the Jan-Mar 1971 issue of Indian Modeller. What about SMAE India? Still alive or gone?

Request members in Kolkata to bring this post to the notice of Ravi/Rishi Kumar at IHC if possible.

Does anyone remember this?

iwincar, the products you have described are fairly general. However, to talk of a 2200 mAh LiPo and 4.3 gram servos in the same breath? Big LiPos are for heavier models, small servos for much lighter.

It seems you are looking at your electronics and hardware from a general use sense, which is good. But I suggest you zero in on a model first, and base your initial purchases around that.

Without LiPos HK is also a good option for purchasing. With LiPos their shipping time can be atrocious, unless you opt for DHL/Fedex.

@KK.Iyer Sir:You just bought the golden age of aeromodelling in front of us.
people are getting busy(Lazy??) nowadays and find time as a excuse for model building.
Model building is dying and now whats left is just RC flying.
Thanks to the effort of all those industries who introduced cheap models to kill the spirit of model building.
Lets take our forum as example, people who build plane are very less numbered. let alone balsa builders.
I personally know a aeronautic student in this forum who bought a skysurfer than building one and had almost 3 people who are my friends who started this hobby and quit it within a short span.

Ashok.P

Ashok, there are 2 sides to this coin

Many people into the Hobby would not be there if those reasonably priced RTFs and ARFs did not exist.

Building requires skill, and patience. (It also helps if you enjoy it.)

There are too many modellers who get turned off by building; many actually start and give up halfway.

The Aeromodelling fraternity has grown tremendously since the advent of these ARFs and RTFs.

Also, chances of success are higher with these. It is not easy to build a model with all angles square, no warps etc. Factories uses Jigs, Fixtures and automation to get near defect-free products.

Many people plunge into building, without knowing much about model airplanes, and meet early failure. A high percentage quit the Hobby then.

Some enthusiasts even start in the Hobby designing their own models. Again, a high percentage of drop-outs in this group

Agreed Sir,

But i dont know what is the contribution from our side while buying a RTF model.
a gasser or a 3D plane is okay. nitros too are fine. but small foamies/corro models?
BTW, still reading your other post regarding prop selection....
http://www.rcindia.org/electric-power/selection-of-motor-esc-prop-and-lipo-for-foam-planes/50/
Simply amazed. and thanks a lot for this contribution sir.

Ashok.P

[Post removed. Posting from personal ID]

+1 Sanjay Sir

While its easy for us Aeromodellers to ask a beginner to build a plane instead of buying an ARF/RTF, one must not forget that Aeromodelling is not just science but an art too, just like music, painting, etc. And mastering an art requires lot of effort, perseverance, passion and most importantly, the guidance of a Guru. While there are plenty of tutorials/videos, it is unreal to expect from a beginner to master the art with the help of these tutorials alone. It is like asking someone to play flute watching videos. While art may come naturally to a select few, the same is not the case with all.

I'm an Aeromodeller and since I'm good at arts, I used to feel that anybody can build a plane. However, I was dumbstruck when students started coming to me with their models for my opinion. There was absolutely no way that their models could fly. Forget wings, most even didn't have the skills to apply glue properly. Sorry for being harsh but this the reality. This is the reason why majority quit after dabbling with Aeromodelling.

Absolutely Vishal 

In fact as a scratch builder, I say that about half my builds don't fly well for various reasons, including faulty build. I enjoy building so I continue.

But if for example I wanted to learn 3D flying, it would be best for me to start with a readymade. I actually built 2; they flew.....but not 3D 

That is the key Sanjay Sir! For most, building is stressful. It was for me for a very long time until I started enjoying it.


Same here. I still haven't attempted building a 3D model  

I think these industries are helping to spread aeromodelling .As a result this hobby is not limited to few rich one's . Now anybody interested can enter in this hobby with less bucks .

Lets not confuse Aermodelling with RC flying. RC flying is just that. Aeromodelling is an art.

i am going to buy kaiser mk2 and diesel 2.5 cc from aeromodelsupermarket and start building.

I just built one. If you haven't built a balsa model before, I suggest you start with something easier

Both are necessary to be in the hobby . Although hobby starts with model making but by flying self built model or purchased one , we can have a inspiration for next model to be built which will be better than previous one with better design and adjustments .

Guillows models?
i just added this model to my cart. cheaper too to start with. wont bite my pocket if i fail in this attempt.
http://www.rcbazaar.com/products/963-lancer-24-span.aspx
reading a lot about doping and so on. can anyone please tell me which tissue to use for covering. and what its called in local market.

Ashok.P

+1

Ashok; a Guiillows is not a bad way to build your initial balsa models. Tissue of very high quality is provided in the kit. For dope, use diluted NC lacquer.

I built 2, Piper Super Cub and Spitfire

One problem I faced was sagging of tissue after putting paint (Fevicryl.) Amazingly though, after a week or so, the tissue tautened, and remained so!

Build log of the Piper Super Cub is: http://www.rcindia.org/kites-trains-free-flight-and-all-others/guillows-piper-super-cub-95-20'/





The Spitfire: http://www.rcindia.org/kites-trains-free-flight-and-all-others/guillows-supermarine-spitfire/

I suggest to start with the simpler Guillows models - the advanced ones can be seriously complicated and involved

There were some really good Mercury models for starting out from India Hobby Centre like Magpie, Gnome, etc. Don't think they would be available now. Sharma Models does make the Applebox, similar to the IHC Orange Box, a great build-it-yourself RC trainer