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« on: March 18, 2009, 05:57:29 PM »
anwar
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This discussion should help guide all newcomers on how to get started in RC on a (low) budget, using resources available in India. 

We are not only looking for general comments or direction, but also specific pointers.  For example, along with saying start with a simulator, post some links to simulators available in Indian stores

If the discussion grows big, we will summarize the important points in this main thread.

Two main tips....   

1) Start with a sim

2) Visit the closest  RC field and communicate with the experienced folks.

So, if it were you, how would you get started in RC on a budget in the present day and age of available resources in India ?
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« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2009, 06:14:16 PM »
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Hi All,

Anwar thanks a lot for bringing up this topic  Clap

As a seller focused on budget products for  beginners to RC I have found many beginners make decisions purely based on the eye appeal of planes and land up with the wrong planes ( it just happened today morning as well).
They assume that flying is the easier part , they see a couple of Videos on youtube and assume they could do it .
One of the important factor that beginners need to always remember is dont go by the looks of a plane when you start of.
I have found many a beginners pass by a very good plane like the GWS slow stick only because it does not look very good , the stick appearance is not very appealing in looks but I can tell you from 1st hand experience this plane is capable of surviving a direct hit  in case of a nose first crash.The other major advantage of planes like this and the MOSS  recently launched by us is they are very easy on the pocket and hence great value for money.

I have come across beginners buying EDF Jets like the MIRAGE 2000 , P51 Mustangs etc .

Another common error scratch build beginners I have seen commit is to making plane like the Profile EDGE , the YAK, NASTY  as their 1st builds just because they appeal to the eye and are easy to make , they pass up planes like the Blue Baby which again is a great scratch built beginners plane again on looks alone.http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=681556&page=8

Beginner have to bear in mind that even the most experienced Pilot in any airforce around the world or for that matter the most experienced RC pilot started with a not so good looking HIGHWING trainer.

SO LOOK FOR A PLANE WITH A GOOD DIHYDRAL WHICH IS A GOOD FLOATER AND GLIDER .

I AM ASSUMING HERE THAT WHEN WE SAY BUDGET WE CANNOT CONSIDER GLOWS AS THE MINIMUM SET UP IN THAT CASE WOULD BE NOTHING SHORT OF RS 18,000 TO 20,000 +. HENCE ELECTRICS ARE THE ONLY POSSIBLITY FROM A BUDGET POINT OF VIEW.


We have a FMS simulator Box  in stock for beginners at our e bay store which is reasonably priced:

http://cgi.ebay.in/FMS-FLIGHT-SIMULATOR_W0QQitemZ110351382016QQihZ001QQcategoryZ2563QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

Sai
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« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2009, 06:03:15 PM »
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Dear Anwar and Sai,
One can go into RC very cheap too. Get a 4-channel Radio approx(Rs.4000)
Get some Coroplast and a plan for a thermal soaring glider(Rs 200 to Rs 300)
get 2 servos Rs 650*2 = Rs 1300

total 5500 5600 is enough

What about your views.
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« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2009, 06:27:11 PM »
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Ashok ,
I agree with you .That is precisely the case with Mr MOSS the Glider  being offered by us.

http://cgi.ebay.in/RCFORALL-MR-MOSS-GLIDER-BRUSHLESS-BEGINNERS-RTF_W0QQitemZ150331948788QQihZ005QQcategoryZ2563QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

This Glider is close to unbreakable because :
1) The Fuse is a Slow Stick Fiberglass fuse
2) The Motor does not have a shaft that will bend
3) The prop is mounted with Prop saver
4) the wings and tail are CORO.

This comes with a full set up of servos , brushless motor , esc , LIPO battery , LIPO charger , turborix 6 channel radio  with receiver .

The crash resistance of this is phenomenol.

The design is proven as it is a scaled down version of the IIT sp4mm3r 2009 winning Glider Mr Moss which used to do hard spot landings.

Sai
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« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2009, 01:28:32 PM »
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Sorry to bump in guys:

I have a point to make.The first thing is It would cost Rs 22500/- for someone to begin with a RC beginner model in a nitro set up.The set up is as follows:

Futaba 6EXAP 1 Unit
.46 Trainer ARF
.46 JBA F Engine
Glow Booster With Charger
Manual Fuel Pump and all other stuff required to go on air.

If a new comer buys this.The only thing that he requires to do to move on other planes is to buy the model.He can install the engine,servos and receivers back into the other plane.also being a 6 channel radio it can last for a long time even if the pilot moves on jets.(Practically 6 channel is the max channle we use).So glow too is a good value.Now with the advent of pushers we can move into a jet with basically the same set up used in a trainer 
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« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2009, 01:39:39 PM »
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Ganesh ,
You are right  Minimum for a Glow Set up is around Rs 20 - 25,000.

While for a Electric set up like a branded product like GWS Slow Stick the Budget would be around Rs 9-10,000

Self made Kits Like Mr MOSS would be around Rc 6500 to 7000 ( max ).

A great Beginners plane like the Multiplx Easy CUB would be around Rs 12,000/-.
Sai
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« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2009, 02:29:22 PM »
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also being a 6 channel radio it can last for a long time even if the pilot moves on jets.(Practically 6 channel is the max channle we use) 

6 channel will last a really long time for airplanes.  But if you plan on getting into helis also, get a 7 channel, as a CCPM nitro heli with a governor to control the engine rpm will require 7 channels. 

Those should really last you a life time !
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« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2009, 02:45:08 PM »
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Well a 7 channel is the best if we include heli into the mix but the cost just goes up a notch.Also one thing i need to stress is though a electric setups are indeed quite good,i personally stick to the nitro one's cas i need to hear the roar of an engine.It is my personal choice and i have nothing against electrics.Also another point i wanna make is the with futaba we can be rest assured of the quality(in terms of life and acceptance).I myself had a problem while we where marketting a lower cost brand as ppl in India seem to dislike quality products without brand names.So this makes the cost go up further.
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« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2009, 02:57:44 PM »
anwar
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Yes, that is "comfort in numbers".  It seems to be the main reason why Futaba, JR and Spektrum continue to be the top brands, even though many others are equally good and cost less.
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« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2009, 07:29:11 PM »
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Definitely Electric Power is the best because all you need to refuel your plane is electricity to charge the flight battery.It is the least expensive. Also Li-Po batteries and brushless motors made low flight times and low performance a thing of past.Now electric power systems are available which can not only equal but also outperform Glow powered models.Glow fuel is available to fyers living in cities only.Also methenol is a controlled substance and it is against the law to pocess in any quantity without a special permit. Even keeping stock of petrol at home is against the law. I strongly believe that future belong to Electric power.
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« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2009, 03:34:17 PM »
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Hi,

I am really new to RC... and wen i say new i mean not even ABC... I was just going through the net looking for info on remote controlled planes. And i was pleasently surprised to chance upon this site.

As far as i have understood, is a simulator all i need to start? and if i do get this simulator, i can download the software from the links posted by Mr. Sai and really get started? Please correct me if i am wrong. Could you also guide me to wat to expect with the simulator?

Thanks
Sajna
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« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2009, 03:45:21 PM »
anwar
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Welcome to the forum Sajna  Smiley

Yes, the simulator is the very first step that one should take when they are venturing into RC. 

Depending on your budget, you can make two choices here.

1) Get a sim use only transmitter. 
Pros:  Least *initial* investment           
Cons:  You may outgrow it pretty soon, and you will have to get a real radio later anyways.

OR

2) Get a radio that can work for the sim and for actually flying RC aircraft.    
Pros:  Long term, safe investment.
Cons: A bigger upfront investment.

My all means, I would pick [2], unless I am one a really low budget.  Forget it, I would do [2] even if I am on a budget, since I have to spend that later anyways.

Here is a discussion of Simulators from our sister site for RC in Qatar :  http://rcqatar.com/simulators/flying-simulator-(training)/

Another great option is to get a beginner plane/heli that comes with a sim.  Our 1K sweepstakes is such a deal  Grin
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« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2009, 04:09:49 PM »
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thanks a lot for the info anwar.. wen u mean option [2], will it be enough to get the FMS tht rcforall has put up on ebay and download the software for tht? will i be able to use the same on a real (i mean hobby) plane?

Please bear with me if my Qs are really basic....  Smiley

thanks
sajna
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« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2009, 04:23:26 PM »
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Hi Sajna ,
I think what Anwar means is go in for a regular Radio with a SIM input jack and use a cable like this to connect it to the  sim on your computer :
http://cgi.ebay.in/FMS-CABLE-FOR-FP_W0QQitemZ110368731893QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_203?hash=item110368731893&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262

FMS in my opinion is good value for money as  any sim prepares you for the real thing to at best around 70 - 80 % but the real thing is always different from the sim what ever you do , hence FMS in my opinion is good enough.

You can start with  a Model like Mr MOSS or Slow stick which  are difficult to break on a crash of course the choise depends on the budget.

You will find rajsigma ( Rajesh ) did very well with his plane on the 1st flight itself  so it is not all that difficult Grin.
Sai
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« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2009, 04:25:50 PM »
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Can try the following steps, as I did and got into simulator flight.

1. Buy a good Tx - invest for one that will last a long time - these aren't cheap even at the prices offered online.

2. Download FMS simulator.

3. Go to www.smartpropoplus.com and download the smartpropoplus package and follow the cables and installation steps (cabling is pretty easy with some spare wire to set up the Tx with the simulator) on that site.

4. Start off with flying on the simulator.
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« Reply #15 on: April 03, 2009, 04:31:44 PM »
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Yes, what I meant is explained in the two replies above. 

If you can afford it, get a good radio with a trainer/sim port that will last for a while (years), and get a sim cable (or build one of your own).  You can then get FMS, or even other/better sim software off the web.
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« Reply #16 on: April 03, 2009, 05:36:17 PM »
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RealFlight from GreatPlanes is a great sim. Will be nice if it is available locally, may be expensive. There are free downloadable demo versions available from www.realflight.com as well. But that does not support a joystick interface. AFAIK FMS is the only one that is free and usable with a Tx.
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« Reply #17 on: April 03, 2009, 06:39:18 PM »
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Guys. I do not support piracy, but you can get the RealFlight form here too.
http://thepiratebay.org/search/realflight/0/99/0
An option for people on low cost.
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« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2009, 08:33:01 PM »
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To me the best way to start in this hobby is getting one of those many chinese made toy RC planes which are available for Rs.1000 to Rs.1500 in local toy shops. They come with everything fitted and RTF from the box.They are usually made of plastic fuselage and foam wings and tail feathers.They are tough and survive many crashes. These planes are usually fitted with two motors (one on each wing half).They use the motors thrust to maneuver  the plane. They come with a 2 Ch Toy type Tx and a Rx with 2 built in ESCs to control the speed of the motors,Flight battery and battery charger. After hand launching the plane and trimming the plane for level flight  to fly up you increase the speed of both motors, to fly down you decrease the speed of both motors and turns are accomplished by increasing speed of one motor and decreasing the speed of the other motor like that. They can be flown in very little spaces . They dont cost much and are much better than simulators to learn and overcome the problems like orientation confusions and such.They can be flown at a walking pace. I really think one should fly one of these toy planes before getting into the real things.
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« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2009, 11:12:27 AM »
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i think that the previous post is right. instead of investing a huge sum ( rather investment) into the hobby at the begining stage itself, buy some low cost rc gliders which comes in 2 or 3 ch. atleast i can fly without the fear of crashing and spending again for spares.
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« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2009, 11:58:38 AM »
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Akash,
I started in this hobby some 9 or so years ago just like that, and it is far better than spending hours on FMS type free simulators which I did at later times and found the first method is the better choice. IMHO FMS is a nice video game with virtually hundreds of plane choices and dozens of flying fields for free downloading which you can play with any RC Tx with trainer socket. I still play FMS whenever I wish but no free simulator can prepare you for the maiden flight enough. I don't know about Great Planes RealFlight or other such expensive simulators. Now I own good Radio systems and 11 hobby grade planes all imported but I never regret buying that 1st cheap toy type 2 ch RTF plane which taught me the basics in RC flying.
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« Reply #21 on: April 29, 2009, 05:38:51 PM »
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RAO,
You are right, Tolearn driving a car you need to sit and drive a car, No videogame can teach how to drive.
similarly to fly an RC plane one has to go for a real RC plane.
BUT FMS has its advantage too. One can get a feel of the remote and also get courage to fly the real RC plane.
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« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2009, 05:51:40 PM »
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With due disrespect, I totally disagree  Wink 

Unlike a car or a real airplane, flying RC models require adjusting your mind to the reversal of controls (if the plane is "coming towards you"), and one needs to get his mind used to that idea before he tries the real thing.  And spending time on the sim is *the way* to do that.
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« Reply #23 on: April 29, 2009, 06:58:14 PM »
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Thats true, but the point made out is that you learn better with the real thing than with a sim. Only that the real thing better not be a $500 deal when its in pieces on the ground Grin
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« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2009, 07:00:10 PM »
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Of course you need the real thing !  But that better be after spending at least an hour or two on the sim  Roll Eyes
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