RC India

First PA Bandit landed here in India with the bling , bags and a PA Tees too, thanks to Mr Adad, very well packed, neat, and in 5 days from Australia to Meghalaya, here is the unboxing pic, watch out more build and fly log



and PA Tees

first impression

pluses are :-

(a) Build quality is very neat

(b) Pre Hinged Aileron, compensated for aileron drag and therefore Induced aileron Yaw is minimised

(c) Hinge line is sealed, thereby reducing back force on the servo and preventing leak of top and bottom surface pressure

(d) CNC Machined CF batt tray

(e) Balsa Fused with CF, strong and light

(f) Very easy access  canopy hatch

(g) Bling package has the wing bags designed to protect wings with the VGs, CF Spinner and Wheel Pants

(f) Very well made motor box, however with previous two experiences i can tell you, it need reinforcement before mounting

(g) CF Reinforced servo tray, means no slack in movement and strong hold

(h) Double CF wing

(i) Stab and elevator pre-hinged and sealed

Electronics

1. This will have Thrust 40 Motor ( http://www.thrustmotors.com/thrust40.html)

2. 12 Gram Metal Gear servos

3. 60 Amps Blue series ESC from HK

4. German flexible preventing RF noises and features low internal resistance servo extensions

5. 12 x 6 prop

6. 4S 2200 mah nanotech batt

PS
Also read this post of Anwar Bhai (Which started my sojourn (and finally enamored) with Precision Aerobatics) http://www.rcindia.org/electric-power/precision-aerobatics-high-quality-arf-kits/

Here are some videos by Michael Wargo & Daniel Dominguez

and review here (http://www.modelairplanenews.com/blog/2011/10/27/precision-aerobatics-bandit-exclusive-review/)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KD6xXta55qs&noredirect=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzLi9qgDR6w

Hey MJA,
Take care of your body. Looks like slight dehydrated in summer. Use plenty of frutes and frute juice. This is not only for your health but for our guide. ;D

Please take care.

Thanks Kalyan Da

Had to sleep on a electric blanket last night and at this place temp in the morning was 8 Deg (It is always 6-7 deg less than town because of height), that is the summer i am enjoying here, and like i told you, make a trip and let us fly together (Make it on a sat or sun)

link for the product

http://pabandit.com/

Got the pa bandit red a month back
i have broken the carbon fiber landing strut so replaced with aluminum strip
so plane kisses the ground for landing  :giggle:



Regards
Vasudev
 

so gusty you are not the first in india   ;)

Kalyan Gusty is loosing lot of excess baggage with his strict fitness regime now a days. Every time I am on phone with him, he is on a Trek or Jog. :)

I am really envious to follow suite.

Congratulations Gusty for the Bandit

ok Santa ! i stand corrected !! first to fly Bandit like a Bandit :giggle:

Vasu
 Good flying there , some 3D ? video ?

Thank you augustine sir
she was Airborne only twice
too much wind
waiting for this week end will try out 3D if wind is favorable

Regards
Vasudev

Looks like finally i have an upper hand in 'The Battle of Bulge' thanks, watch out for build and fly of bandit

here is the pic with my daughter of the PA Bandit post successful maiden, maiden was done while it was drizzling, had to land back as the drizzle became rain, like santhosh says you can hardly see the aeroplane in the video (Followed theleabres style) camera on the ledge. Took off and entered hover straight, well set at 103mm cg, controls neutral, no trim, flew like a dream

Gusty some photo which I took

Congrats on the maiden,waiting for the videos,hope I can see the bandit
Bandit instead of the sky this time ;D

Ha Ha Ha  ;D

The time we choose to fly is all wrong. Late in evening the light condition is always very bad.  Added to that the infinity focus camera with wide angle of view makes it more worse.

I will try try to come there to shoot for you :)

same story santa ! will put up the video, see if you can spot the aeroplane, if you can, i will give you one Muttai ! what say :giggle:


waiting ! eagerly

@santosh   :thumbsup:  thanks you are most welcome.

Checks before you assemble
1. Check  for any damage. Mine had, a few ribs had (May be transportation, may be production scatter, minor repairs as needed)

2. Check for warp, Tape the Control surface in the neutral position at the wing root and see length of the control surface to ensure they are perfectly straight. Most of the time they are not. Atleast all my three aeroplanes had warped aileron and or elevator if there is wash-out or wash-in (Check my Aerodynamics Jargon post for definition), remove it by slowly twisting the control surface to the opposite direction and applying hobby iron to the wrinkles on the covering that will form because of your twist.

A few Tips
1. Epoxy can be cleaned using Denatured Alcohol.
2. Magnets may be fused. (My addiction had this problem, may be the Chinese factory where it is made sometimes, sit the hatch before the glue dries up) excessive force will break it. Some ingenuity required there to remove them
I have used Voltec servos, they are OK, here is the pic, my servos (All four) doesn’t centre well, reported the matter to PA, will send them a video to if they want, let us see what they do ?

A few Cuts !!  ;D
1. Iron around the edges.

2. Make openings in the covering film, (a) aileron servos. (b) servo cables, (c) wing bolts, (c) wing anti-rotation pins (d) elevator servo (d) rudder servo (e) landing gear (f) cooling air exit (g) wing tube,


3. Save the cut covering for later use.
Aileron opening is too big on the fuse, after attaching the wing you will see a bit of the outside world.
Tips
1.  Opaque covering needs to be marked from the inside to cut from the outside.
2. Elevator servo and rudder servos could be mounted on the same/opposite side.
3. Dry fit the control horns, before gluing.
4. Hot paperclip could be used to cut, I used Xacto 11.
5. cut extra and seal them with iron.

Ailerons
1. A pair of 9" extension leads is needed.
2. See image, take out the extension through he given opening.

3. Tight fit is not good, enlarge the opening.
4. Use a Pin-vice to drill a hole on the mounting tab.

Tips
1. Dead Centre Locator tool is recommended however not required.

2. Do not use excessive on this aeroplane anywhere, remember this aeroplane is .60 size aeroplane weighing less than .20 size, so all balsa and CF are thin for their size
3. Same goes for servo mounting hole, holes needs to be reinforced, else you run the risk of servo coming off in flight. (My addiction aileron servo came off, inspite of this reinforcement)
Control linkages installing them is a pain, if you make a mistake undoing them is again difficult
 1. 3.5”  one (Shorter ones) are for ailerons.
2.  Control horns, Two identical are for Ailerons, One with a Single Hole is for elevator and one with Double Holes is for Rudder
3. Sand CF control horn’s base.
4. Dry  fit the CF horn.
5. Use the metal clevis, clean it, it could have rust/dirt in it (Mine had).
6. Connect metal clevis to the aileron horn. Enlarge hole if required.
7. Dry  fit the 2.0mm bolt.
8. Fit the M2x6mm clevis bolt and check for a smoothess.
9. Over tightening will clamp the fork.
10. Once all ok, apply Loctite.
12. Install the metal clevis for other control surfaces too.
13. Epoxy the control horns perpendicular to the control surface.
14. Epoxy bulb will create a solid base to the horn.
15. Support till glue sets.
Tips
1. Servo arm at 90 degrees to the servo case ensures linear and symmetrical throws in both directions without the need of sub-trims. cut off the other three unused arms if you want to.
2. PA Carbon Fiber servo arms are required for 3D, you can DIY too. These are not included with the kit, you will have to buy them separately.
3. Ball link goes on the bottom side of the servo arm in this sequence M2x8mm bolt/ball link/CF arm/nut.
4. Apply Loctite.
5. Lightly sand, CF pushrods for good bonding.
6. Servo arm at 90 degrees to the servo case in the neutral position (Tape them on both ends), dry fit CF pushrod.
7. Shorten the CF pushrod if required to fit into the ball link.
8. Tip sanding if needed.
9. Once done, epoxy one end of the pushrod and insert it into the other end epoxy that too.
10. Pushrod and the ball link positioned horizontally to the clevis and pushed in. Servo arm to be 90° and neutral position BEFORE the epoxy sets.

Landing Gear  
2. The order of fitting is Bolt/ Black Washer/CF gear strut/ Two lock nuts /Wheel /Lock Nut..
3. The wheel between the two lock nuts tight enough to free rotate with no wobble.

4. Tyres and rims may require some glueing.

5. Loctite it.

1. LH RH  LG struts are different see image.
2. Wheel pants at max height for flying from grass. See image.
3. Mark and pinvice the self tapping screw hole with a 1.5mm bit may be.
4. Using the self-tapping screw attach wheel pants.
5.Tap and not not apply force on the self tapping screw (That's why it is called Self Tapping Screw  :o).
6. Use M3x10mm black bolts and washers fro attaching LG to fuse.
7. Loctite it.
8. Cover the landing gear bay (They have given a strip for it).

Elevator & Horizontal Stabilizer
1. pre-hinged  stabilizer and elevator comes with the kit.
2. Ensure the hinges are aligned and centered after inserting the elevator into the horizontal stabilizer. 50° Deg (or above) up and down deflection is required to set the gap.
3. Ensure equal gap before gluing the hinge.
4. Takes about two min of quick deflections.
5. Pull the elevator and see (Not too hard though).

This important step is to avoid pressure leak from top and bottom surfaces, improves flight characteristics immensely
6. Trim and Crease the covering strip it into a "V". see image
7. Iron it to one side, deflect the control surface fully and iron the opposite side.

Fixing Stabilizer
1. Remove balsa at the rear of the slot to shove the elevator in.
2. Cut and  Keep this piece after fixing the elevator put the same piece back (I do not use the supplied piece since it is not coloured, slighlty big and needs sanding etc)
3. Dry fit stabilizer, do not force it.
4. Sand or file to widen the slot if tight, elevator should go in all the way.
6. Align and check parallel to the wing sand the slot if required (See image, I had to spend several hours to get this right, once again, production scatter by the manufacturing unit in China).
8. Epoxy it, could use 30/6min epoxy (I use the stinky 6 min epoxy).
9. Check alignment.
10. until the epoxy sets hold the stabilizer parallel to the wing see image.  
11. After glue sets, slide the cut balsa wedge into the gap and epoxy it.

Rudder and Tail Wheel
1. Cut and remove the covering of the groove at the bottom of the rudder.
2. Dry fit the tail wheel, mark it, and drill a hole with a 1.5 mm bit.
3. Apply epoxy and install the LG into the slot, one more layer on top for better hold. (See image)
1. Dry fit and widen the hinge slots if required of the rudder;.
2. Check alignment of the rudder and fin.
3. Put half hinge hold it in place with a very very little CA (Don’t use pin to hold it in place).
4. With rudder flushed at the bottom of the fuselage and rudder fully deflected apply a few drops of CA on both sides of the hinges and keep deflecting till CA dries, pull it and see.
5. Seal the hinge gap as explained earlier.

 Elevator & Rudder servos & Linkages
1. Use 14 to 15" extensions.
2. Dry rudder and elevator servos with output shaft closer to the control surface.
3. Pinvice with 1.5mm drill for the servo mounting screws.
4. The servo mounts have ply doublers reinforcement not required.
5. Servo leads runs along the bottom of the fuselage use cable ties if required to secure them.
6. Use CF pushrods 92mm for the elevator and 111m for the rudder.
8. Fix  elevator and rudder control horns as explained earlier.

9. Rudder slot is 10.6mm from the bottom for rudder elevator is 6.4mm from the root rib for the elevator for marking the slot.
10. Horns and clevis and the ball links are fixed same as ailerons

 Motor Box
1. Reinforce motor box with Titebond and or epoxy and fiber glass cloth. During hard 3D it is known to give way, mine did thrice (In 'Addiction' twice and 'Addiction X' once)
(http://www.toolman.co.uk/acatalog/titebond3.jpg)
2. Motor box needs to be sitting on the fuse without any gap with all CF rods touching the fuse and the box, dry fit and sand as necessary. (See image).
3. The design of the motor box and the firewal is unique, this long corbon rod actually transfers thrust to the fuse (Partly) instead of, to the firewall. A very novel concept.
4. Once the fit is ok, long pin is not protruding out of the cowling. apply epoxy to all the surfaces coming into contact with the bulkhead at the center top and reinstall the motor box back in place.
5. Epoxy to cover three CF pins them.

12. CA the center top of the motor box to hold the box in place while the epoxy dries.
13. Apply little bit epoxy along the point of contact between bulkhead and the motor box.

14. sand the motor box as shown for fitting the cowl. (I think PA Botched up the design here)

 Motor, ESC Installation, Receiver and battery Placement
1. The motor is installed as shown.
2. For Thrust 40, remove the C clip off the motor shaft.
3. DO NOT over tighten the four motor mounting bolts, you may run a risk of crushing or cracking the motor mount plywood.
4. Apply Loctite.
5. attach air scoops as shown. (Another very Novel Concept).
6. I mounted ESC in a manner that batt is easy to attach and the residual air cools the heat sink.
8. Recheck direction of motor rotation, if wrong correct it by changing the esc's black red polarity.
9. Velcro RX on its tray.
13. To prevent the battery from sliding on the CF tray you can stick a small piece of anti slip matt used in cars.

 Cowling Attachment

1. Cowl is attached using four self-tapping screws 2.3x10mm with soldered washer with 3-4mm of overlap on the fuselage.
2. The bottom of the cowl may require two notches to clear the landing gear struts.
3. Use tape drill technique to achieve alignment of cowl and fuse
4. Mount the propeller and  spinner  cone as well. (My CF Cone will be mounted once i change over to 12x6 prop for a 4S Setup)

Gusty sir, the bird looks like a monster in your last image after fixing the cowl  :giggle:..

i am slightly worried about the tail wheel, because the epoxy you applied after fixing the tail wire has been applied over the covering. in my opinion, the covering adjacent to wires should also have been peeled off,before applying it again..

 Wing Attachment & Center of Gravity (CG)
1. If CF wing tube is a tight fit, don’t fit it, instead sand it.
2. Follow this procedure 1.CF wing tube into one wing until hits the stop. 2. Then wing to the fuselage, align CF anti-rotation pins (do not attempt to force the pins in, sand it if required).
3. Grease the nylon wing bolt else it will break.
4. Install the other wing.
5. The CG range is 99-105mm, however Sweet spot (Sounds like 'G' Spot or something  :giggle:) is at 103mm for 3D and 99-100mm is for sports flying or flying in windy condition.
6. If 103mm is too neural try 101.5mm as it was a slightly easy to trim.

Tip: Great Planes CG gauge is what i use

 Radio & Control Setup
You should have centred your servo before fitting, if you didnt do it, do it now.
1. Check that the control surfaces are moving in the correct sense.
2. Servos travel adjusted binding should not happen.
3. Use deflection gauge (Supplied) to setup control surface. These throw settings are mine, use these as a starting point and adjust them to suit your personal flying preferences.
Ailerons High rate 50°Expo: 70% Mid Rate 30° Expo 35%Low Rate 12° Expo 30%.
Rudder High Rate Max Throw Expo: 70% Mid Rate 35° Expo 42%Low Rate 27° Expo: 35%
Elevator High Rate 50° Expo: 70% Mid Rate 30° Expo 35%Low rate 12° Expo: 30%
7.  2200 mah batt TX timer, set it to 5 minutes. expect 6-8 minutes of flight.

 CF Vortex Generators installation
The installation of the Vortex Generators (VGs) is very simple since the slots are pre cut. However, since the top side covering is solid it requires a certain technique
1. Place the wing up side down.
2. Cut pre marked slots.
3. Mark top side slot from the bottom up.
4. Flip solid covering facing up cut along the marked slot .

5. Glue tabs of all the VGs needs Roughen up.
6. Dry fit of the VGs, DO NOT force them, widen the slot instead (Very Slightly)
7. Once OK apply a layer of epoxy (DO NOT use CA) over the tabs and inside each slot. Cover entire base of the VGs with epoxy and once fitted in leave a bit of epoxy excess which will create a solid base and seal the gap with the wing skin. Ensure no gap at the base of the VGs

That concludes the Build Log


Thanks Abhay ! It is called Precision Work, just enough covering is gone, it is so precise that you can't even see it. :giggle: That's why it is called Precision Aerobatics :giggle:

That's one cool build log Gusty.  :thumbsup: Very beautiful plane.

Nicely done and congrads.

Thanks Sandy ! Cool Aeroplane too

i didn't have a T-40 prop, one call to Santhosh and he sent me the last spare that he had !! Thanks Santa !!

great build log  :hatsoff:... next time try to get this for your linkages

Did you mean in your next trip, you will try to get this for me :)

Get your next PA plane,  will give you one , sure

here is the Maiden Video, it was drizzling, Need to practice mode, Hover Torque roll was ok, better video when Santhosh reaches here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrIER4pvuOw

superb flying :hatsoff:, this time plane is clearly visible . watch from 0.07 to 0.14 ;D

:giggle: that's a still picture santa :rofl: this was at 04:40 in the morning

Gusty sir add scale spinner,this beauty looks more gorgeous!!!!!!!

Thanks Praveen i have the CF scale spinner (Came with the bling package), will add them after a couple of flights

PS
Review of CF isn't good though, can break in flight and cause damage/ cause hurt. Will still give it a shot

Precision Aerobatics team sent me a mail! urging me to edit this thread (I used to wonder, who are these so many guests reading our forum, that explains), since i used words from their manual,

so people who have read this thread earlier, you could read it again, it was a blessing in disguise. in an attempt to edit it i found, i simplified it further. now it is less intimidating and easily readable.

Which part they urging to remove or modify sir? :headscratch:

Done that praveen already ! so well done that you cant even see it :giggle:

Good one Gusty...Miss u guys

Likewise Karma!
between Addiction X and Bandit, Addiction X as of now,

PS
we have default news channel in all our offices. It is never changed and is shown without audio, basically we watch the ticker tape for any important info. that default has been changed from NDTV to CNN IBN, once ! for a breif moment, caught you looking down (Like 1/20th of a second) :giggle:

Hi Gusty,

Nice choice, nice build, nice plane, nice flying. Just one other thing I'd like to add,  ummm, NICE.

So a glider is next on the agenda. I've already finished my Phoenix 2000. The
 build was so easy on it, not one drop of glue required. Maiden in 2 weeks but Bixler next week. I'm about to start building the Predator and fitting it out with FPV gear after it's maidened and trimmed out.

Happy flying mate, regards  Stu

Thanks Stu!
this voltec servo is killing me! just doesn't center, anyways here is the pic of the flight yesterday! when the rains stopped, we ran to the field and flew our hearts out

More of a "hot" one, I would think!

Hi Gusty and hello Sushil-anand,

Some of the servo can have a poor quality pot in them and a dirty surface can cause intermittent settings. If it was mine I'd be tempted to pull it down, give it a good squirt of a PCB orcontact cleaner. They both come in a spray can and you just drown the electronics and let it sit to dry and put it back together. The main cause of the problem is the potentiometer or variable resistor which is situated under the main drive shaft. Asmall row of "fingers" make contact with a resistive strip and as the servo rotates These fingers make contact with the strip and by the level of resistance the electronics can tell where the servo is in it's travel.

Simple wear from a well used servo can cause problems as can a build up of dirt or occasionally the strip just wasn't applied correctly when built. Using a good contact cleaner is the best remedy only if it's dirt causing the problem. Anything else is just delaying the inevitable and the servo may last a little longer but fail again. If this is the case then it would be better to mark it as faulty and keep it for spare parts.

I must add that pulling the servo down is best done methodically, remembering the way the gears are mounted otherwise putting it back together can tax the brain. When the "pot" is pulled apart check the fingers to see that they are making good contact. If you havea multimeter the resistance can be checked by rotating the main shaft. It should be nice and smooth in it's reading, an intermittant reading will show that this is where the problem is.

The biggest question could be, is it worth it. That depends on the price mainly and do you have the time to pull it apart. Personally I opt to pull them down. Not because I'm a cheapskate but I enjoy fiddling with things to make them work. Only yesterday I pulled a servo apart with stripped gears and swapped the gears for some out of a servo which had a burnt out motor. I saved myself about $3.00 .... maybe I am a cheapskate.

A word of warning, avoid using WD40 or similar and silicone derivatives as these can damage some parts or leave a residue which will gum the works.

Happy flying to you both and best wishes  Stu

stu,

thanks for such a good info, yeah in this hobby you got to be cheapstake! in india nothing goes waste, we are exceptional in using what is considered trash by the rest, servo rework is people's pasttime.

However! these are brand new 20$ ea servo.

Hey Gusty,I have a question for you. Is there a plane in your Airforce which can carry enough fuel to get to Australia and back. Carry a fair amount of computer, HiFi and other electronic equipment and get you back home before the plane or you is missed.

I have a mountain of gear I'd love to give to the boys over there but I'd have to charter a big plane. I tought that seeing as how you can borrow the keys  could you nip over sometime :-) Our airport is unattended after 8pm at night so you could dead stick it in and no one would know. I'm sure the guys would chip in a few dollars for fuel.

Just a thought  regards  Stu.

Comms on 21.400mhz. SSB

what a noble thought !

It was worth a try :giggle:

Seriously, I would like nothing more than to hand this equipment to forum members. Although the equipment is worth a lot of money for some reason the people around here want it for free. I'd rather choose who I give it to and I'm sure it would be appreciated. Unfortunately that's all it is, a thought with no remedy.

I will find out what freight fees are to India. Maybe some smaller items can be sent via mail.

Stu

Thank you.  :salute: :hatsoff:I am capable of sillier stuff while anchoring  ;D i almost walked out of the studio once

Karma

nevertheless, you are the best in the gen next at CNN IBN, not because i know you i am saying this, be that as it may, as you asked and for anyone who cares, here is the iPAs link for a 4S setup, Aeroplane, motor, esc, 4S batt, servos and the prop and the works (No VGs and Spinner, you need to get them separately, if you need them)

http://www.precisionaerobatics.com/product_details.php?pid=698

order it online at their website and it should be at Delhi through EMS 4-5 days max

PS
paying through paypal was PIA for me, took me 3 months to accomplish that

Converted Bandit to 4S 2200mah setup, 12x6 prop and carbon spinner, due to poor servo centering couldn't fly hard 3d, kissed wing tip twice (not by design) while trying harrier. here my mom posing with the Bandit

sir ...  which are the servos u are  using in this...??

still not able to  decide on  the servos for the skyfury...! its lying as a hanger queen

Its 46size ryt.. any high speed servo somewhere about 0.15speed n below are good... All standard servo suits 46size 3d plane.. Try getting digital n metal gear.. For durability.. Im using futaba 3003s on all surfaces on ucando3d 46.. No issues till now .. No blow backs.. I have literally abused it like anything.. But still servos holding firm n precisely centres.

This aeroplane presently has Voltec servos (http://www.voltecservos.com/vts70.html) 10.7 gms servos 25 $ + shipping.

Will be switching to MKS DS 450, i am told they are good servos, for a 9.5 gms servo they produce 3.22 Kgs of torque, can you believe that ?

Turnigy 16 Gms should do in your aeroplane i guess

so TYG it is....!

hi there gusty uncle try using servos from savox usa... its n upcoming brand....but there servos are damn great for their price....you can compare them equally with hitec....i have been using them myself for 3d n pattern

Hi there,

Very nice build thread, many thanks for the effort sharing your tips!

Right now I'm playing with katana md and can't fit the cowl without leaving a gap between the fuse and the cowl from their left side. I saw how you sanded the motor box edge and I'm wondering is this lowering the strength of the motor box, if I sand mine did I have to do something more to keep the strength? Currently I have enforced it only with the fibre cloth that comes with the kit and epoxy.

Thanks!