RC India

I've been interested in this hobby for some time now, and I think it's time for me to buy my first RC Helicopter. My ultimate goal in this hobby is to be able to fly collective pitch with ease.
A lot of websites have described the progression, Coaxial -> Fixed Pitch -> Collective Pitch. But, contradictorily I have also read that Coaxial and Fixed Pitch are very stable and experience on them is not scalable to CP Helis.

 With a limited budget what should I get for my first helicopter (I can't get all three)? - should I start with a coax? (Blade mCx2) A Fixed Pitch? (Blade SR series) Or, Should I start with a collective pitch helicopter (Blade nano CPx) and tame it down with the transmitter settings?

Thanks.
Harish.

Start with a Micro or a Nano Quad.
The flying characteristics of a quad is very similar to a Heli.
I would put such small quad (Not toys though) somewhere between Fixed Pitch and CCPM helis.
Quads are much forgiving than helis and comes with considerably cheaper repair costs.
You won't need much spares either.

You can easily get such RTF quad in about 4K.
Once you spend some time and achieve stable flights, get a 100 sized ccpm Heli which would cost you about 9K (RTF)

This is something i've never heard before. :) Lets say I follow your advice and buy a quad. If I'm able to hover it well, do you think I'd be able to do the same with a CCPM easily too?

This is a nice thread about what you said.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2003538 (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2003538)

IMHO it's the best path to a CCPM Heli.
It still won't be "too easy" though. I mean you will still have to spend some time practising :)
Still a hell lot better than jumping from a FP to a CP.

I always believe that you do need 3 things to be successful in this hobby.
i.e. Time, Patience and Money
If you lack any of those there is high chances of failure and things getting wrong unexpectedly, etc

I am sure you would do fine.
Best of Luck!

I would say go for highest size collective pitch that you can buy, maintain and can crash often..and buy a simulator if you can.

Why Highest size? i started with a 450 size when I did not know abc of RC (let alone helicopters). I crashed immediately on my first attempt to fly it. That is when i realized it is harder than i perceived. I started studying basics and trying simple things like skidding on floor left right without taking off etc. i was extremely careful. Still, i crashed a lot. While still crashing, within four months, i bought a 700 size and you know what crashes disappeared (no crash for first 1 year) for couple of reasons- bigger ones are more visible from orientation perspective, more stable and you don't try too many things for the fear of crashing. No crashes for a longer term does induce some confidence though you know that you have not progressed much. In case some one is not in a hurry to learn it is actually good. Moreover, the learning is never linear with respect to time. Once you strt getting used to concept of flying things start getting easier. Immediately, after flying a 700 a 450 appeared as a beater heli as the intimidation factor was gone and shifted to the bigger one.
Yes bigger ones are expensive to fix but do not underestimate smaller ones. They easily become money suckers moment you start buying upgrades and blings. I have seen machines that require upgrades even to become flyable. Therefore smaller ones end up being more expensive. This is another thing i learned don't go for blings.

Why collective pitch? Personally, i feel people consider fixed pitch and coaxials to learn orientation and cover cost and intimiditation factors. I found these toyish. IMHO, coaxials are crap (i could not fly one even though i was able to fly collective pitch). It is better to invest in simulator to learn orientation. Anyone serious about this hobby should buy a simulator.  The flight charcteristics of coaxials and fixed pitch is different from collective pitch.

I now realize that i went the opposite way - first collective and then fixed pitch (just for trying) If you want to learn collective pitch ultimately then go directly for it. I do not consider collective pitch as an extension of fixed pitch or as next step.

The biggest hell I can buy and maintain is the Blade Nano CPx. :) And it's also the smallest heli I've seen.

Hehe..  ;D if you really have this heli bug, you will definitly buy more and larger helis..you will find innovative ways to manage budget...this hobby is not cheap..consider tools..charging setups...etc

 By the way have i have not researched about nano..how well does this machine do?

Turnigy FBL100, Balde Nano CP X, HiSKY FBL100... All of these are quite agile.
The kind of difference in agility that you experience in between the 700 and 450, just multiply it multifold and that's how agile these little copters are.
Because of the tiny weight, they can change their attitude rapidly and soon gets far enough to lose orientation for a newbie.
Good to learn 3D though (with extremely short expenses than that of a 700 ;D)

I agree with the fact the "larger" is also a good option to learn. But for someone who is tight on budget, nothing beats the Quad > Heli route in order to learn a heli well.

Bhavesh, i have not flown a quad but still I can not visualize it as a stepping stone in learning a ccpm heli or quad->nano ccpm heli as the best route for someone on budget.

A heli is structurally very different from a quad. I dont believe they have similar flying characteristics. Usually people fly helis getting cues from rotor disk plane and boom. Use of tail rotor in piro and different orientations also needs to be learnt.  As far as crash cost is concerned, these nano type helis are also very forgiving. And, since someone is on budget why buy both - a quad and then a ccpm? Why not buy only a ccpm and keep money for spares. Remember that crashes are not always bad. Crashes sometimes teach you how not to crash (realization of mistakes).  Mistakes causing crashes in helis might be different from quads. Therfore, such mistakes will not surface until you try a heli. You will still need spares. A simulator and a small ccpm heli can also be an option where you can try other sizes and types of helis from the begining (experience may not be as realistic though). One more point that comes to my mind is that a bigger part of this hobby is fixing and maintaining helis which requires understanding basic heli designs and principles. E.g. How does swashplate work? Phasing angles etc etc....So, why not start learning those straight away?

For me quads and helis are different types of flying. They both can hover but I suppose that is where the similarities end (not considering 3d capable quads in market). No body stays at hovering. They all ultimately graduate into either flying sport, speed, 3d or whatever. So, you can use the same heli for progressing further that you used for learning a hover.   Whereas a beginner quad will reach shelf soon after learning hovering unless you developed specific interest for it.

May be i am missing something as i have not flown quads..But whatever sails your boat.

Shakti, would you suggest building a Trex 450 clone as your first helicopter?

A trex 450 clone will be good idea as most of the clone/OEM parts are available with RcBazzar and RcDhamaka . But can't expect much out of clones . They are good for basic learning and sports flying (fits your requirement as of now) 
and
Get a sim and learn for atleast 1 month and get your basics/orientation clear . Once you are comfortable there , You can decide better .
Now i have shifted to bangalore for college so can help you on sundays . I myself fly helis .

Where do you live in Bangalore?

Sorry for late reply
I live near Kanakpura - Jain University .

In Varanasi we do not have hobby stores to be found in my knowledge, i am still 13 yrs but need parts such as a brushless motor and esc;s rest i have already crafted of my own

Then you can buy online.

I am not a pro, infact dhruv , shannon and anwar are better fliers dan me. But, i have been through clones, mcpx , nano cpx, trex450,  hk 450, raptor 50, x50, raptor titan se and.a.gaui x5.
Do u have a good sim? If yes start prac. I never practiced on fixed pitch or coaxial. You can start with a cp heli provided u have patience and your setup is tame.

If ur budget is limited, get a good clone like alzrc. Though, personally i stay away from them. They are a money pit. Dhruv and shannon have plenty of experience wid alzrc kits. They are nice helpful fliers. Stay away from hobbyking kits.

Why buy a quad if u dont have any interest in them? Invest dat money in spares or a sim.

Its a costly hobby. U cant go cheap wid a heli. I lost a heli due to an esc failure in midflight.

Save and invest in proper equipment. It will take you far in this hobby.

There is no brand which can be considered safe and reliable no matter how expensive it is. As I have seen castle Esc and Jr or spektrum receiver brown out issues.

However considering its going to be your first, I would recommend invest in a cheap but durable heli like a v911 or a micro quad so you can enjoy this hobby rather than spending time repairing or tuning it. As in my personal experience both of them are really durable and fun to fly. Also these do not burn a big hole in your pocket.

Although sim practice is still required.

Buy a clone and then, keep upgrading it. You may get lucky initially with the clones. I have seen people doing 3d with hxt servos but eventually u will outgrow them. Considering the number of castle esc and jr spektrum receiver in air, the failure rate is negligible.
Why not invest in a decent radio and a decent heli.

Neways , ur money ur choice.

I simply feel that today this route best suited me for Quads and helis. As most members stated above my case was similar, it was multi rotors that made me lean towards helis and also aided to confidence in flying both helis and Quads. Started in 2012 with >model art Quad plus extra batteries and spare blades learn first then progress > Rs. 5k >WLtoys V911 with extra batteries and a couple of spare motors as the main motor looses power as they get used and old. Rs. 5k approx. Heck! a BNF heli from WLtoys costs as much as some original simulators.
Once you are comfortable with both which are pretty easy to fly go ahead and purchase a WLtoys V 977 micro brushless 3D heli (CCPM) with a few extra batteries and a lot of spares. The following route / path was just a coincidence (No I dont plan my purchases well in advance) based on availability (in store) time and of course funds. I had no prior experience with helis on a sim and in fact just wouldn't like sitting on a sim when the real thing is virtually the same cost as the sim and Hubsan Quad as well as V911 are simply un breakable. I was planning to go a different route i.e. Align Trex 450 which costs about 10 times the total of buying assorted quads and helis with spares of course and learning to fly the real thing. After each crash you will notice a change in behaviour of your machine MOST IMPORTANTLY adopt to flying it with some damage get a hang of it suffer the pain of the damage, source parts and repair it and FEEL the difference in your machine right away. Hands on learning is way better than virtual I personally feel but each generation is different and learning curve varies from person to person. That said muscle memory and the passion you have to fly your machine along with money (which gives confidence to take risks to fly ) at your dispose.
I bought a model art Quad and V911 together in 2012 which i didn't fly much as I spent time on fixed wings at first. Also got the Hubsan 107C micro quad. Practising a lot on simulator but nothing beats the real thing. Stay away from the big brand helis and do some reading on other forums about micro helis V911 V966 V977 etc.
I gradually progressed and only recently 3 months ago re-ignited my passion for helis and still thinking whether a 450 size will make sense at all (micro anytime anywhere sun or moon indoors in a small room) because going to a field each time is more strenuous  than the actual flying. Of course its large size intimidates me but still is it as practical.
That said this is just my 2 cent and each one to their own. I was in a similar situation at first but this is what worked for me. ;D Good Luck  :thumbsup: