Hello All. I'm new here and also to the hobby. Bought my first 450 size heli last week - Hiller 450 V2 RTF from RCBAZAAR - HUGE and EXPENSIVE MISTAKE. Everything kept falling apart from day one and absolutely no help from them and I was treated quite badly too. However, decided to stay with the hobby and make the necessary part changes / repairs by myself. The first day the 6ch fsky receiver burnt off - had to upgrade to 9ch TH9X and 8ch receiver. Then noticed that main gear was already stripped (replaced that too), then the tail servo burnt off (replaced that as well) and today, a new issue.  I had my first spool up and a couple of hops this morning (after 7 days of buying the product). 3 - 4 minutes into the activity, the motor stopped working at close to half stick and does not work after. There is a visible gap in the motor now. Throttle cut is "off" so that's out of the question. All curves are set and worked very well for the first couple of minutes.  I read that there may be an issue with the retainer cup on the motor itself but cannot find it. Actually I'm unable to remove the motor itself as the screws are stuck fast and allen keys are of absolutely no help. I also read that the issue may be with ESC. Need your advice on fixing this and getting my bird operational again. Please help.  Thanks in advance.

Hi Hemak,

The issues mentioned in the post above are clearly related to newbee issues, you should not straight away blame the shop or the product on the forum like this.

Let's pick the issues one by one.

1. "Everything kept falling apart" - This happens when you as a newbee don't use or don't know how to use loctite on a 450 machine as it's not a toy.
2. "First day receiver burnt off" - this again happens if you end up connecting the esc on the Rx with reversed polarity.
3. "Gear was already stripped" - if you installed the motor and it was not properly aligned to the main gear and if you try to spool it will rip the gear. So you need to be very sure that the motor is correctly aligned with the gear.
4. "Tail servo burnt off" - This happend cause you did not set correct limits on the gyro or you did not select the correct servo frequency or you did not flick the digital vs analog switch on the Gyro.(depends on gyros)
5. "Todays issue"  - Have you calibrated your throttle on ESC with the Transmitter, I would recommed that you first calibrate the ESC with motor connected  (look for youtube videos) and then again check the motor.

6. Not sure what you mean by gap, please post pictures/videos first so people can help you.  

Hellyflyer

1. a bad gyro or an esc can make you mad, can make tail have a brain of itself. And make you abase when either getting an esc or gyro doesnt solve your problem.

2. every time you have a mild hard landing that continues with bending of main shaft..

3. Unknown source of wobbles.

4. Slipping of screws and you like to commit sucide

+1 Hellyflyer
Please read and watch videos regarding heli setup and building on youtube or go to helifreak.com for finlessbobs videos
NO Matter which brand of helicopter you buy though it is mentioned RTF READY TO FLY its the pilots duty to check for all screws have thread lock weather the transmitter is set correctly or not ....
A rc helicopter is not a toy but a scaled down version of a real rotor craft and has to be checked prior to every flight ....
And yes these things do happen we all have been through this phase
MOST IMPORTANT BUY QUALITY TOOLS
1. So first step now is to access the damage
2. Get the replacement parts
3. Learn how to set up heli electronically and mechanically
4. Please ensure u remove every screw and apply threadlock to screws going into metal only  
Mr sujju   has videos on youtube showing how to programm esc set up and build helicopter i suggest you watch them
Even PR from GAUI ALIGN EFLITE THUNDER TIGER ..mention that thought the product is RTF PLEASE make sure to check for thread lock on screws ....
ALL RTF are assembled in factories so due to human error things get missed out like thread lock and stuff due to human error hence it is our duty to check for this as rc pilots ....
REST if u need any help we all are available tc and happy landings
OH yes and please practice on simulator if u have no prior experience in helicopters even hovering you will save alot on crash repairs  
http://www.youtube.com/user/RcBazaar
 
 

lol avesh it aint that bad

RTF = READY TO FEAR

Thank you all for your replies.

Sorry for the delayed response. Was working with a guy from rc71.com - it's a store in Hong Kong where I bought my other 2 helis (Align TREX 100S and Walkera Master CP with Devo 7). He helped me find an ingenious in house way to eradicate the problem. The issue is caused due to cheap motor housing that comes loose and can be easily fixed at home. He helped me out though I did not buy the heli there. RcBazaar - learn customer service.

@Helliflyer -  I'm not a noob to helis - I'm new to 450 size and bought this one against better judgement. I'm not unhappy just because these ppl sold me a lemon, but also because I had to face their rude, condescending attitude and mindless bungling when shipping. I've been into RC for over 20 years (I'm now 34) and have many cars which I maintain by myself. I also build robots (have been ever since I go into college) and not new to the nuances of gears, servos, motors, sensors, Tx, Rx etc...only this was the first time I've ever seen a motor split in half - cheap quality being the reason. Also, there is a huge difference between the terms "Falling apart"" and "Flying apart", obviously you mistook the term I used.

Shannon and Avesh thanks a lot for your advice. Avesh is right about RTF - lol.

Which motor did you get?
I bought a tail servo from them which they thought was digital and the same was given in their website.When i used it with a gyro with the digital option,it burnt off.I took it to their store and they replaced it,and that's when they found out that it was an analog one.Regarding customer service,when it comes to customer redressal i hate talking to the guy named shiva or shivu(not sure what his name is).He is polite and all,but as soon as i say there's something wrong with any of their product,that fellow jumps and says some crap and concludes it as our mistake.He  behaved the same when i talked over the phone about the servo.Then i talked to dilip and he told me to come over.Whenever i call them i prefer talking to dilip

OK Just to clear a little bit on the above topic ...yes shiva is soft spoken and nice but when u tell him bout any of the faulty parts or electronics he jump starts by putting blame on us well shiva has little knowledge in electronic and helicopters so he kinda gets hyper ..happen to all of us if we are asked bout something we have little knowledge about ...so next time u have to ask anything regarding helis pls ask for dilip or contact sujju through mail ...both will help u out ....
JUST TO CLEAR THINGS OUT
no i dont work for rcbazaar nor am shiva lol 
just noticed this whenever i spoke to him regarding anything 
if u have any problem dont hesitate to mail sujju tc guys 

v5hemak can you please describe what actually happened with respect to "rude, condescending attitude and mindless bungling when shipping" ?

shannon i think you dint read my last few statements.I always ask for dilip.I know shiva isnt an expert.I think he tries too hard to act like one.

yeah i did read that was just mentioning to people in general 

Your first post says, everything kept falling apart,which is what I used I am not sure where your getting the term flying apart.
The reason why i considered you a noob was may be cause of the way you posted the issues, overall you did mentioned that you are new to 450 helis which is the samething.

I can't say much abut the service as i have not faced any issues from them.

I am glad that the rc711 guy sorted the issue.

take care
Hellyflyer

@rajathv8 - I went to their store with my wife last Saturday at about 8pm...Suresh and Dilip were at the store. I spoke to Dilip and told hhim this will be my first 450 and asked if they had the RTF version which comes with all electronics pre assembled, battery and charger. He said they had the last piece and advocated it is in great condition. I did not visually inspect it as it was all packed and hence picked it up along with a few spares like cf blades, tail rotor, extra lipo, pitch scale and swash leveller.

Came home and charged the lipos and early next morning (Sunday) plugged it in to try to spool and check blade tracking. As soon as I plugged the batttery, smoke started emanating from the 6ch receiver. I called the store immediately and Dilip asked me to go to the store..so I went there again. The store is about 25km from where I live and the traffic is horrible. When I went there I met the owner Sujju - he was genuinely interested in solving my problem. He asked Dilip why he sold me the RTF and not asked me to go in for the kit - no answer from Dilip - he said he felt I had decided - I had clearly mentioned otherwise the prev evening. I anyway told them that I'd rather upgrade to 9ch TH9X tx and 8ch Fsky Rx as it was computerised. Came back home, connected the rx, did the binding / programming etc with the tx and rx - have been fine since. By now I had downloaded all the videos and started doing basic checks - did some work wrt removing all screws, applying loctite / plastic CA and tightening them back. The tail belt was loose, tail was not alligned as well - did all those.

When checking the main gear for clockwise movement I found that the main gear had no teeth on 5 different locations. Called the store again - it was around 7pm. Suresh said there was no one in the store - Dilip & Sujju were in Chennai and will return on Wednesday, but he asked me to send an email. I sent a detailed email immediately with 3 different pics of the stripped gear. No reply till date. On Tuesday I ordered a gear set as I did not want to wait any longer for a reply.

I did not receive the package for two days. I kept calling and following up with the store and was given the number of a Mr. Harish with first flight couriers. He told me it was shipped with my incomplete address - only my house number and city with pin code and he had returned the package and the same is shown on the first flight tracking website - I got back to the store - they blatantly disagreed and blamed first flight. They said they'd call me back in an hour. This was Thursday already. I did not receive any calls and I called back in the afternoon and spoke to Dilip. I was explaining the amount of troubles I have faced in the package and asked if they could replace this with a complete unbuilt kit and that I would pay extra as needed. No reply on the other side. I silently listened and could hear Dilip talking to someone else - apparently he had placed the phone receiver on the table and was talking to someone else - ths ticked me off big time - anyway I waited till he was back. Asked him what I said and what his answer is - he grew defensive and started arguing that I was not listening to him but he still could not answer what I had asked about the kit replacement - he had no clue - no apology no nothing - I hung up.

I then received an email from Suresh (I was marked in Cc). The email was to first flight courier demanding that they deliver the package and this time he had mentioned the full address - but had forgotten to mention the pin code. Now I stay in an area called B Channasandra, but there is another Channasandra at the other end of town ad the courier guy went there as there was no pin code. I replied to this email and also mentioned the experience with Dilip in that email. I also added some more questions wrt shipping status and what First Flight guys had told me.

Ten mins later Dilip calls on my mobile and sarts arguing as to why I wrote all that and when he behaved that way etc. I told him what he had done was wrong and shameful and told him I still dont have an answer to the question I asked him - he laughs and states that the problem is with me. I told him I dont want to speak to him anymore and hung up. Still no response from anyone on both the emails. Dilip may have just deleted them to hide it from Sujju.

Later that evening Suresh calls me back stating that first flight guys reported that my phone was off and gave me the courier company's area manager's number. I spoke to him and got to know that the package was elsewhere - he said he would have it close to where I stay but I have to pick it up myself - I agreed - went to the office near my place at about 8pm after work and picked it up.

I installed the gear and spooled it up - all fine and no issues. Now, I was again checking for blade tracking when smoke started emanating from tail servo - it was destoyed. As I am a robotics hobbbyist too, I had a few spare servos at home - picked a V2 8g servo installed it and calibrated it - no isues till date with it - all ok - I didn't even bother sending an email / informing the store.

This morning,  I went outside, spooled up, did some hops and low ground hovering (on traiing gear). Increased throtte to about half stick (50%), motor stopped working and the heli started jerking - this was about  - 4 mins after spooling up. Throttled down and disconnected - found that the motor casing was coming off - gap between the motor head and body. Posted on this forum and also contacted another store in HK for help. Thankfully they were able to immediately tell me what I should do - did it - heli is spooling up again. Another isssue now is that the 4mm male connector towards the motor - the middle one, is hanging by a thread to the wire - ordered parts from rotor.co.in and waiting for it - once the spares arrive will solder it before even trying to connect the lipo again. Not bothered to email / inform the store as I know what to expect by now.

This kit has mostly plastic parts n also the link from the main rotor to the flybar cage is fully plastic and it isn't possible to tighten or loosen tthem to set blade pitch - I have ordred Align links from rotor.co.in as well. All the electronics on this kit are unbranded - no name - no seal - no stickers - nothing on any of them. Extremely pathetic quality both of the product and the staff. I have ordered 2 helis from rc71.com (Hong Kong) and each time I've paid less than half the money on shipping than what it would cost to drive to rcbazaar. I have also ordered some Align electrics and parts from this store yesterday - the only issue is that it'll take about two weeks to arrive. At this point I'd rather wait than have a repeat of my rcbazaar experience. I also have rc cars and so does my wife and we work on them ourselves - neither of us has experienced such crap before with any store - even when they are not in the same country - let alone same city.

As a well wisher - please be very careful with these ppl. If something works for you consider yourself very lucky, coz if it does not then you'll not only end up with an expensive piece of crap product but also their extremely snobbish and low life staff. 

By the way -- this is the crappy kit I bought:
http://www.rcbazaar.com/products/876-450-v2-ready-to-fly-with-transmitter-lipo-charger.aspx

v5hemak i guess i know how u feel i suggest u have a word with sujju he will help you out with all this ....just explain what happened

I bought the same heli,but the kit..i hope you havent applied loctite on the plastic frame..the links are of low quality,blade tracking is a pain in the ass in this heli..anyways,you cant expect an align quality for this price..

@v5hemak : Thank you for spending time and posting in detail.

1. It is wise to inspect any product before buying - it may save the need to visit the store

2. Some RX's do not like wrong polarity. When the ESC was plugged into the receiver did the black wire face away from the sticker on the receiver?
Its worth mentioning that my ACE Car RX did NOT throw a fuss when i connected the ESC with wrong polarity - this took me by surprise

3. Did you ask for a RTF? The first paragraph says you asked for "RTF version which comes with all electronics pre assembled" and in paragraph 3 you mentioned "sold me the RTF and not asked me to go in for the kit - no answer from Dilip - he said he felt I had decided - I had clearly mentioned otherwise the prev evening". Please clarify - i want to understand f you were forced into buying an RTF or if it was your choice

4. Good to see that you spent some time on the bird before first flight

5. Did you notice the missing teeth on the main gear before the firing up the motor for the first time?

6. The tail servo can go up in smoke if the tail servo linkage is binding, gyro gain is too high or if an incompatible gyro-servo combination/setting is used. Please let us know if any one of this happened, it may help others (and me )

7. "4mm male connector towards the motor - the middle one, is hanging by a thread to the wire" - 4mm connector on the ESC-motor connector? Seems like an overkill to me. What parts did you order? If the connector is hanging by a thread to the wire  one needs to solder the wire to the connector. I dont see why additional parts are requires. Perhaps i have not understood the problem - please post a pic if possible.

PLEASE post images of this kit. The head, electronics, broken motor, battery etc. There are few, if not none, images of this kit on the forum. The images you post will help us.


@muradshak,

The 450 V2 RTF has a plastic head while the Hiller 450 V2 has a metal head.
The 450 V2 RTF has a metal frame while the Hiller beginner 450 has a reinforced fiber glass frame.

The 450 V2 referred to in this thread looks different from the Hiller 450 V2 and the Hiller beginner kit. I do not think they are the same and i do not think a kit version of the same is available at RCB.

Did you buy the kit at RCB?
Please post a link

Please clarify.

Actually they didn't have a combo,i bought the frame and electronics separate.I bought the fibre glass frame which i was referring to,my bad..Dint know the v2 rtf had metal frame ..The links are all plastics.

This link says 450 V2 RTF has a metal frame.

I have the beginner kit too. Not all links are plastic as posted here - post 24 last image shows packet with metal links.

2 links are plastic..

No disrespect to anyone the rtf kit was just made for noobs ..the very kit was made to be a beater kit for noobs ...so u can trash it and crash it i all possible ways ....and for 10k u have a tx rx with electronics and heli its not possible to sell quality electronics even in china at that rate ....most of us or rather most of the people on the forum have all purchased kits and put in our own electronics from different places ..i myself have purchase a 450 pro kit which is really good never had problems  from rcbazaar but i have purchased other quality products from HK USA etc ..how can u expect to get a good TX RX 4 k...initially while building my first heli i spent almost 30K ...buying a good spectrum TX RX ...450 pro kit from rc bazaar ...electronics form HK and usa ...no body is blaming anyone here neither am i but sir u did mention you wanted a rtf ...i have also purchased a 500 kit from them and it was good except for minor bugs like all clones have and sujju helped me out with it ... ...everything at rcbazaar is made cheap for beginners and you cant expect quality if u want them cheap also...   except few electronics like FBL gyro and heli kits and airplane kits are of really good quality and best bang for the buck ...i suggest u have a word with sujju and get this sorted out

 

Now we have facts
All the best with your build (if not already done)

Edit:
The beginner kit as 4 plastic fixed links:
a. 2 links between the flybar see-saw holder SF mixing arms and the blade grips
b. 2 links between the flybar see-saw and the washout block control arms

hey are u guys talking bout the plastic links which go from the mixer arms to the blade grips ??

ok i see that on post 24 well that is not a problem but a major solution its all plastic non adjustable links of a fixed length ...because it is non adjustable it saves you the trouble to measure it so during tracking all u have to do is adjust two sets of links instead of 6 i use non adjustable liks beside the ones that go from the swashplate to flybar mixing arms res are all non adjustable it save u the time and irritation if u guys make an upgarde later on please use the 450 pro linkage set it has non adjustable links