RC India

below is the mail that i got now from Hobbyking... for anyone interested and looking to upgrade or buy a 500 size heli it could be a good time...

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Can you believe it? Just $34.95 for a 500 size heli kit?
This insane price will only last for 12hrs. So get in fast!
A full 3D 500 Heli with Align T-rex designed performance
and now at the worlds cheapest price!
Now just $34.95!
 
 
SuperDeal deep discounts are often sold at below factory cost price.
SuperDeals are not retroactive and only while stocks last.

We had one on our field.  The screws the comes in the kit are really bad.  I had a lucky escape (not in terms of personal injury, but in terms of the heli crashing).  The bolt used to hold the tail blades gave way, but the heli was on the ground.

I advised the owner to upgrade the screws and rebuild, before test flying it anymore.

And remember that the thrust bearings would have zero grease, and some screws would have no threadlock even they may feel somewhat tight.

can we replace some parts of that heli to metal so that the body  will last long ??
if yes which ones ???
users who have these models plz help

The problem with swithing from 450 to 500 is the batteries. YOu would need 6s and atlesat 2600 to 3000 mah. The price of having 3 such batteries shoots up to 100 USD and shipping another 25 USD.

ALso having such a huge heli means costly eelectronics. Like expensive tail servo/gyro etc. All this will escalate the cost of the Heli to almost 300 USD + shipping.

When you are ready to invest 300 + USD, I would suggest going to GT or the CMT models itself, which does not need much of an upgrade compared to T500. Especially after learning on the 450.

Nope... the 500 is significantly different in terms of flight characteristics and visibility, as compared to the 450 class.  In fact, when it came out, it was being discussed as the perfect size for beginners.  It is big enough to be stable, but the crash costs (which should be less frequent than the 450s) are not as high as the 50 size ones.  But of course, this was when the clones were not that popular (or available) ;)

i have two  500 performing very good

I agree with anwar on this.. this is a good size heli for beginners… I started with the 250’s of the world and I ended up spending a lot on repairs… a 500 would have given me the confidence and the feel of a good hover and also would have save me a lot on paypal a/c… electronics are a bit expensive visa vis a 450… but again for beginners go for the clone.. like the fitec 9650 servos each costs around 10 usd or the turnigy which again is quite cheap… yes a good gyro is required be it for a 500 or a 250 or a 450. For beginners I suggest that they fly heavy and then move to the twitchy helis.

Keeping in mind all that has been discussed above, how much would his Heli finally cost (with all accessories - Gyro, batteries, Tx/Rx, servos, screws, nuts and bolts etc.) ? I have someone visiting Hong Kong next month and I may ask him to pick up one. I need your help to understand the specs on the other components required.

Regards.

Trying to answer my own question :

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9388
Bare Heli Kit  $40.00

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9764
Motor  $ 22.23

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10113
Gyro    $ 13.99

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=3727
ESC     $ 39.99

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9391
Servos X 3  $ 42.00

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6306
Battery X 2  $20.00

Misc items $10.00

That is roughly $ 190 + TX/RX

Is this a good estimate?

Regards.

2x3s batteries would give you a flight of 5 to 7 minutes, and then you need two hours of charging (unless you have the capability to charge more than one lipo).  6s batteries would make life a lot simpler.

There is one advantage with 3s cells, you can use them on smaller helis too.

5 to 7 mins? I would not agree! Max 5? At what RPMs?

I disagree 500 is for beginners. It may be stable. But its got lot more power and responsibility. Deserves better electronics. A 450 should be a true beginners heli and then switch to 500 after learning hovering. A 450 has lots of cheap spares and are easy to work with. Batteries are cheaper too. Again its all personal choice.

Again cheap electronics can be used on a 500 for just learning hovering. There is also a lot of debate going on on using 2 3s in series due to some current issues/losses  or so.  :headscratch:

Slightly low head RPM can reduce that twitchyness on a 450 right!

Have you see anyone fly a 500 ?  What flight times are they getting (regardless of rpm) ?

Also, you have not seen true heli training done on 50 size (ie 600 size blade) helis ;)  I come from a perspective of someone who has seen people getting trained on all 3 platforms, so some guesswork is eliminated :giggle:

The power and stability aspects are actually what makes the 500 class better suited for training.  It is usually considered as the "sweet-spot heli" for this purpose. Responsibility is there, regardless of heli choice.  Individuals may have many reasons for choosing a 450 over a 500 for THEIR individual training, but that does not take away from the 500 being a better training platform.  

No, I havent seen anyone flying a 500 with 2 X 3S 2200 mah, But I have seen rajesh fly a 500 size but that is with a 3000 mah battery for 8 mins on an efficient motor, and here we are speaking of flying a 500 not on a efficient Align or a Scorpian motor, we are speaking of the HK 500 motor, which is a monster!  ;D

I have been following the HK500 GT thread closely lately for some personal reason ;) and that what they are getting with those small batteries. Yes agreed that bigger helis are more stable. But, being in India and having lot less Heli pilots around to teach, a 450 becomes an ideal choice for following reasons.

Money is important as we earn in Rs and pay in USD.
1)Cheaper kits/electronics.
2)Cheaper battery (3 X 3s 2200 = 28 USD. 3 X 6s 3000 = 100 usd.)
3)Cheaper shipping.(since we have to split as per our customs, shipping smaller batteries /helis is cheaper.)
4)Since not many can find the same mode ccpm heli pilot around, 450 is a lot safer if learning alone.
5)A lot of people have more problems setting up a 500 due to its power (like tail blade ripping off etc.) - on clones of course. I have seen(on the forums) that most people(beginners) mess here a lot.
6)A low head RPM on a 450 can make it very stable, not necessarily need a 500.
7)A crash will be less devastating compared to 500 and cheaper again to fix.

500 advantages.
1)More stable than 450.
2)More power than 450 - not really required for beginners.
3)More visibility than 450.

Comparing the above, it all depends on people choice.

totally agree on the cost aspect as its much cheaper to get a 450 in the air after a crash... and lowering the rpm will give you a slower heli and for hovering and sport only but the "agility" will still prevail.. many people like 450's and also the 250's  because they are quick in the air for some 3d stuff...
and vinay what do you think would be an ideal budget for a complete rtf heli - 450 size and a 500 size (except the lipos, tx and rx)???

1.  Most people order 3s batteries that are in the 2200 to 2500mAH range. With 2 of them, you will get no more than 7 minutes typically on a 500 heli.

2.  The "cheap" part is a one time advantage.  You are discounting the biggest reason why people crash, they lose orientation as the heli moves slightly away from them, and that is where the size helps.  I have seen it again and again in real life.  In short, for a one time investment, you reduce the subsequent crash costs.

3.  Cheaper battery...  you need 6 x 3s, not 3 x 3s to make the comparison fair.  Again, this is a one time investment, and you save on charging time and hassle.

4.  Cheaper shipping, again a one time investment.

5.  Safety is all about where you choose to fly, and how much you train on the sim.  The size of the heli is secondary, once it is on your face ;)

6.  Setup - You can go wrong with both, and the setup itself is pretty similar.

7.  Stability - Stability that comes with size cannot be achieved by tweaks.  Similar tweaks can be done on the bigger heli also.  The most important aspect is the ability to see the heli properly.  Ask everyone who has crashed, the main reason is orientation loss due to inadequate profile.

8.  Crash costs are higher... but if the whole heli costs $40, I am not sure what the big problem is ;)  Plus the idea is that you crash few times.

9.  You can tone down the power of the 500 too.  May people do scale flying with those.

It all depends sujju, I have 2 X 450s and I now feel that I should have got just 1 and another should have been a 500. I out grew the HK401 Gyro and the 450 size very fast and Iam looking at a better deal now. Now there goes all that budget planning in water.

Here is what i can say:

Trex 450 Ideal as per me,
1)Aeolian Trex 450 Pro kit with TT from leaders hobby with its feathering shaft replaced with align.
2)Henge 933 for the Cyclic
3)Turnigy 2836 700 watts monster on a 13 T
4)Turnigy DS 480 servo for tail
5)Spartan quark metal
6)Superbrain 40 amps for better Governer. (CC /Kontronics are way too costly just for the governer.)
7)Flight max battery 2200 20 C.
8)CF Blades from HC

500:
1)HK500 CMT kit with its feathering shaft replaced with align.
2)Turnigy Servos 93X for the Cyclic
3)Turnigy 500 monster on a 12 T
4)Futaba 9257 for tail
5)Spartan quark metal
6)Superbrain 80 amps for better Governer. (CC /Kontronics are way too costly just for the governer.)
7)Flight max battery 3000 25 C.
8)CF Blades from HC.

I Am pretty sure the above helis are cheaper and better than Align originals(not quality wise ;)) and should fly better indeed if built well. People wanting to build cheap for a 500 can go for a cheaper ESC/Gyro/Tail servo.

Hmm I see your point. And all of them are valid. I some what still feel 450 is better. Dont know why I have that feeling. Coz I didnt fly one yet or owned one yet?

Anwar, I think its time to replace the Plane Logo with a Heli?  :giggle: For some reason RCI is getting filled with more helis than planes lately. ;)

It is all seasonal ;)  As long as this remains an active forum where people tend to assist one another, all discussions are good :)

vinay.. try a 500 heli and see the difference...  ;D

Yaavaag bartheera sir mysoorige?

*(When are you coming to Mysore)

But atleast in the sim I can feel its stability of a 500 better than 450.

BTW Just replaced the OS 50 engine from the trex 600 to OS91 on the sim and made the engine weight 0. Flys like tareq's helis.  ;D Dosent even Bogg at +14 or -14

Out of topic:

Another nice Heli Video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1f0SfVoZMU

you know what???.... i think i will have to get you out of the negativity of a 500 heli ... you get yourself a 500 from Hk or anywhere and i will send you the electronics... 4 cyclics, tail servo, motor, gyro and a esc?...

Hey, thanks for the help, but I dont yet have a car to carry it to the field if I build one  :giggle:. I already have a quark 9257 sitting at brothers place in US, just waiting for some one to come to india.

I still carry my 450 on my bike.

Ah damn, time to sleep, have to goto driving shcool at 830 morning. GOd knows what all RC will make me do and buy  ;D