RC India

Which HK Heli To buy:

Many people have been asking me what to buy! More people than I can answer in my Leisure. So I thought I make this thread and guide the people here who want to buy them.
This is a decent beginners, decent budget heli.

Note: You will need to have a 6 Channel TX with E CCPM 120 Degree support and a spare RX and a 3S Lipo charger.

1)
a)Pro Series: These are good. If budget permits, get this and stick to the PRO series instead of getting V2 Series initially and then upgrading to the PRO. Some head and tail, body parts are not compatible between PRO and V2.
HK-450GT Pro 3D Belt-Drive Helicopter Kit (Align T-Rex Compat.)
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10902

b)V2 Series: I read that some faced tail vibration issues, but thats all luck with helis at this price.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10900

2)Servos: X 3 Required. D933MG Digital Metal Gear Servo 2.0kg/ 12g/ 0.10sec
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10977

3)Motor:
Beginner: Turnigy Typhoon 450H 2215H Heli Motor 3550kv (450 class) - Use 11 T Pinion
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9021

Advanced: Turnigy 2836 Brushless 450-Size Heli Motor 3700kv - Use 12 T pinion
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8137

4)Battery: ZIPPY Flightmax 2200mAh 3S1P 20C  X 3 To enjoy. Minimum 2 recommended. I have 8.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6306

5)Gyro:

New Gyro but Good! HobbyKing GA-250 MINI-MEMS Gyro - Iam not sure if this supports Analogue servos.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=15318

Old gyro. Hobby King 401B AVCS Digital Head Lock Gyro. Its good, but some experience a slight drift to the left. None the less, its livable.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10113

6)Tail Servo

Digital: Turnigy DS480 Digital Servo 1.85kg / .068sec / 10.9g
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8511

Analogue: GWS Park HPX Servo 19g/.05sec/3.6kg (JR Plug) - THese are fast! but I havent mounted them yet!
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=4696

7)ESC: TURNIGY Plush 40amp Speed Controller
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2165

8)Hex Drivers: Turnigy Long Shaft 4pc Hex driver set. Note that you would need 2 1.5mm Hex drivers to remove the bolts of Feathering shaft.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11048

9)Some medium thread lock. Anabond blue and loctite 222 low strength Threadlock

10)Get TONS of spares. It would usualy mean:
a)FiberGlass main blades.b)Main gear set,c)Tail Booms d)Main shaft, e)Feathering shafts, f)dampeners, g)tail shafts h)belts i)flybars j)landing gears

as far as i can remember. these are the ones that usually break. Your luck can be bad so get another helis as a spare    ;)

11)Pitch guage
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9653

12)Swash plate leveler tool.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11041

13)Ball link pliers:
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9801

14)Screws for mounting motor:
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8714

15)Training skid: Get the skid with an aluminium hub. My first heli crashed due to the breakage of the plastic hub(which i got from heli direct).
http://cgi.ebay.com/3D-Big-Training-kit-Alum-Metal-Center-450-Heli-/180555273285?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a09eed445

16)Bullet connectors for connecting motor to ESC.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9284

17)XT60 Connectors for battery to ESC:
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9572

This configuration is based on what I have used till date! Except the Gyro. Iam not responsible if you dont like this, or if this causes problems to you in anyway!

And do yourself a favor! Dont buy any Heli stuff from EBAY!
If you Build an HK Heli, then you can build any electric Heli :thumbsup:
If you build an EBAY heli, you may not build anymore Helis  :thumbsdown:

UPDATES:
1) Beginners should stay away from torque tube versions as the umbrella gears strip on medium hard landings. Updating here as per post #68.

Heli Gurus, please let me know if something is missing.  :)

Made this thread a sticky ;)

The DS480 tail servo has been perpetually out of stock !  My order has been in BO status forever !  Someone wanted to buy my HK450PROTT, but with cheaper electronics, so I have been waiting for this to swap out the GY401/S9650 combo !

Why did you not list the HK401B gyro ?

If you can authorize me to edit the first post forever.  ;)

Its outdated and has a slight drift to most of them. Only few people get good ones. The Ga 250 looks like a good one. I have one on the way. I will add the 401 B as well to the main thread.

Very nice to see you help people build their heli's.

You forgot one thing which you have already mentioned in one of your build thread

Its a must for begginers
Training gear

http://cgi.ebay.com/3D-Big-Training-kit-Alum-Metal-Center-450-Heli-/180555273285?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a09eed445

Also i have the same motor as you specified for experts it didn't came with screws.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8714

Also velcro Tape for battery.

As for maintainance
Either singer sewing machine oil – cheap
Or
Tri-flow oil
http://www.helidirect.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=TRI-FLOW+6oz+NON+AEROSOL+DRIP+BOTTLE

I would also recommend getting a pair of 1.5mm allen wrench
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5418
For removing the feathering shaft.

I have both the triflow and scorpion motor bearing oil. scorpion motor bearing oil is far far better!  ;)

The tri flows and sewing machine oils(which I got) are almost water! The scorpian is the best consistency, neither watery nor thick!  :thumbsup:

I have Updated the LIST.

I already mentioned the hex driver set, hex wrench may not be required.

For tail servo i have this
D922MG
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=10976
can't this be used. The tail servos which you have in the list is little bit high in cost.

Also add this
Turnigy 4.7mm Ball End Reamer
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11140

The screw link at the start missed out the product number please correct it.

Also if you listing all the things which is needed to build the heli.
A vernier caliper is also need.

I haven't buit my hk450 GT V2 yet. but i have all the product which you have mentioned here.

Can the TURNIGY Plush 40amp handle the amps required for the Turnigy 2836 Brushless 450-Size Heli Motor?

I have used the 922mg and saw a drift(Probably bad gyro  8-)), the gws was much faster at a lower price. So if anyones wants a good tail servo the ds480 is it and its WAY better than DS420 or 922mg! I didnt want to confuse the users with too many choices.  ;) If you want me to put it there I will. Is a ball link reamer really required? I have one with me since 4 months and I have never bothered to open the pack. The hk ball and links that they ship as of today are almost perfect!

Yup I have not seen it pump more than 30 amps till date. It only is amp hog on 4S! Which I am going to try on my 450 pro.  ;)

Note that a vernier is not required, a simple steel scale will help you measure stuff as good as vernier!. I have a digital vernier but now I use scale and it has become way too easy!

The idea is to list the MINIMUM required stuff to build the heli, I will put the rest in the optional List. Will do it at night. got work.

One of my swash plate links was very tight. Since i haven't assembled i am not able to comment on other links .you can't say that all hk ball and links are perfect. So it better to put 2$ more to see them working fine. Without prior experience about the gyro (Ga 250) why have you listed it here?

I have been happy with Triflow, because it is thin, yet it does its job well. Thicker stuff seem to attract more residue. 

Try it out anwar sir, the tri flow is general purpose, and scorpion is designed for RC bearings.  :thumbsup:

 Have u ever felt that tri flow removes the grease out the bearing and makes the bearings pretty loose and wobbly after using triflow?  ;)

That is where I felt Triflow did a great job, it being general purpose.  A lot of heli problems I get into are usually with residue on the tail slider, tail linkage, head assembly etc, which are not exactly bearings, and are quiet exposed to the dusty environment we fly in (even otherwise, helis stir up quite a bit of dust).

ya correct but thats only for the slider and swash. But I still prefer scorpion for bearings. it does a better job in compoarsion and I now use this oil in all the bearings on heli run the heli for few mins inside the house and wipe out the excess with a tissue.

Why dont u get 1 and try it out your self, its just 5bux + shipping.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=17195326&postcount=3408

Can you make the first post editable. Coz I plan to maintain it for long.

Thanks Vinay. Very useful. Can you add some blade suggestions for the HK450 with a beginner in mind.

Will do it, today iam busy, gimme some time, also you can use the same electronics that you got with your align pro for the hk 450 pro, if you dont want to spend more.

Hi Guys,

received My KH-450GT Pro Kit yesterday evening from HK.

Have done the unpacking. Everything was nicely packed.

Will upload pics shortly.

I need help from you guys to build the same.... :)

Rahul

Here is what i plan to use on this setup :

HK 450 GT Pro heli - Belt version
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10902

Turnigy DS480 Digital Servo on rudder

HK929MG Digital Servo

HK 401B AVCS Digital Head Lock Gyro

Zippy Flightmax 2200 3S1P 25C

Turnigy Typhoon 450H 2215H motor 3550kv

TURNIGY Sentry 40amp Speed Controller


I dont know why I am not able to attach pictures ? I tried many times it gives internal server error

What size images are you trying to attach ?

Also, the GA-250 gyro was reportedly better than the HK-401b.

The HK450GT PRO tail servo does not go on the boom. You have to make a simple mod to get the DS480 in the rudder servo tray. Make a servo mounting adapter to fit the tray such that the servo horn reaches the linkage.

I am trying to attache 4 pics in 1 post( image size @ 90kb each), still getting error  :banghead:

Must be something with your connection. Can you try attaching just one image ?

Anwar bhai, try to attach DSC00618.JPG but it gives error " HTTP 500 internal server error"

04/24/2011  06:37 PM            87,093 DSC00618.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM           111,752 DSC00619.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            94,255 DSC00620.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            82,687 DSC00621.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            87,932 DSC00622.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            96,251 DSC00623.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            93,858 DSC00624.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            89,004 DSC00625.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            89,080 DSC00626.JPG
04/24/2011  06:37 PM            88,241 DSC00627.JPG

Thanks Ashwin for the "TIP", Can you post some pics for the said MOD...   :help:

Also like to know what type of grease to be used for thrust bearings ?

Can you try once more ?

No Sir!!! same error still...

Once more :)

There is something strange about your session, it seems to be allocating more memory than others.  What browser and operating system are you using ?

Anwar Bhai, using Windows 7 ultimate 32bit, IE9, Internet connection 10Mbps (in office)

let me resize pics again with "IrfanView" for WEB View

Here are pics for my HK shipment !!!

Some more  ;D

Some more again !!!

Will post more once start building the Heli...

got my heli after 20 from the date of ordering via air parcel :)

will enjoy building this kit with the help of you guys.

HK-450GT CCPM 3D Full Alloy Helicopter Kit (Align T-Rex Compat.)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10900 (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10900)

attaching pics

I ordered for 3 sets of wooden blades and 1 set fibre blades. the kit came with 1 set of fiber blades.

electronics are coming in another parcel. will put the pics when i get them. :)
more pics

Hey Akash, Finally you got your shipment deliverd :)

yup :) very happy  ;D no customs was levied  :)

I used an the align servo tray with the align servo, so I haven't done this mod yet. But do plan to in the future.

I use this grease.

http://www.readyheli.com/MINITRIFLOW-Tri-Flow-Grease-14-oz-Bottle_p_35506.html

Got My Whia Hex Drivers today....  :)

1.5mm x2
2mm x1
2.5mm x1
3mm x1
4mm x1
5mm x1

hi netsecrets00

from where u buyed it ?

i m looking for it.

Hi Nehutech, I have got this locally for  :Rs:1550/-

I have a cheaper alternative. Its Jackly 31 in 1 electron screwdriver set. costs  :Rs:130, bought it locally. It contains hex 1.5, 2.0, 2.5, 3, 4. The holder is magnetic, hence it holds the screw. Comes handy in a small lantern style container. The only drawback of this is its length. It can reach to depth of 1 inch.

As it has happened to me my piece of advice is, dont use this. You will damage the screws.

that,s too bad. does these hex drivers strip the hex screws? :headscratch: stripping of screws is because of bad screws, which dont have required hardness isn't it?

Yes the screws are not that much good. But if you have a hex which fits exactly then there will be no issues. Dont try these cheap ones. Atleast go for the hobbyking hex drivers.

Do I have to set DR for any of the controls ?

Instead of DR, for beginner setups I would reduce the aileron and elevator throws using the swash mix menu. I would also add some amount of expo (-ve for Futaba).

Also, to slow down the piro rate (ie, how fast the heli rotates via tail when rudder is applied), I reduce the ATV/EPA (endpoint or travel adjust) to 75 or 80 for the rudder channel.  Note that ATV/EPA is NOT the same as DR.

Having said all this, there are many ways to skin the cat !

Anwar can you give me the numbers

No one can afford screws made of steel used in good quality screw drivers. So, it is upto a good screw driver to take care of the screws. As Azhaguvel said, the hex drivers should precisely fit into the socket and shouldn't slip.

Its a really bad idea to brick a 5000+ heli by using a cheap 120 screwdriver. If not entire set, please buy a 1.5mm Hex driver from a good brand like Whia shown by netsecrets00 above. I am using them and they are real god.

The numbers for swash mix cannot be carried from one setup to another, it depends on your linkage setup, including where you have placed the ball link on your swash servo arms.  So what you can do is to measure the angle of swash tilting for aileron and elevator, and try to keep it around 6 degrees, no more than 8 for a beginner setup. 

The expo I use is around -30, again for beginner setups.

Hi Guys, I will be traveling to US this week end, this time i am planning to start on heli's... and for a beginner i guess this sticky is very useful. But i do have a few questions, 
1.) Can any one please suggest a Tx and Rx for this HK 450 pro .....      :help:

2.) And if am goin for a Turnigy 2836 Brush less motor, will the ESC TURNIGY Plush 40amp mentioned in the thread will work or we need a different ESC for Brush less system ?

thanks,
merin

a)Iam not sure about the radio, You might want to tell us your budget for that as well as how long you might want to stick to this hobby.

b)The 2836 will work with plush as both are brushless. The 2836 comsumes 27 to 29 amps at -12 degrees pitch on a 12t pinion at full throttle.

Thanks vinay.. i want some thing around 50$ dont want too basic stuff to.. so tat dont want to buy another soon....

Thanks,
Merin

1. Turnigy 9x is good

2. Turnigy Super Brain 40A Brushless ESC + H2223 Brushless outrunner 3500KV + 14 T Pinion = ~3000 RPM

This is good enough for sport flying

Hi Raja_mastatna,

Have you used the Superbrain esc to measure current/voltage etc. If yes, how accurate was it? I have one with me, but havent got the chance to use it yet.

Sorry, i didn't get your question about measuring.
I use it my 450 PRO heli for nearly 3 months and very happy with it.
I am using the same configuration that i suggested earlier
Turnigy Super Brain 40A Brushless ESC + H2223 Brushless outrunner 3500KV + 14 T Pinion = ~3000 RPM
I fly for 5 mins and i have to put back 1600mA in my zippy 2200
The motor / esc are quite hot when flying in a sunny afternoon, but no power shutdown or anything

The Super brain ESCs have built in current and voltage sensors and loggers. After flying you can connect it to a comp using a superbrain key and download the data. BTW on the 2836 and plush, both get barely warm after full flight(7 mins of sport flying) at 100% throttle curve and I put back 2000~ when I charge.

ok the logging, yes its good enough (it cannot be be accurate since gear rate is integer only)
i think was pulling around 18 to 20A max IIRC. I dont use it regularly though

thanks guys  ;D , me too was goin thru the reviews of super brain 40A ESC, its good but many had report heat problem and thermal shutdown. Is there any other alternative ESC i can use, with built in datalogger ? in combination with 2836

 ???

Also i find the TURNIGY 9x backordered, in HK, are there any other stores ? I dint find one..... help please ....

Hmm, AFAIK The cheap data logger ESCs like Superbrain(or anyother if there are) may not be much useful as they are not accurate.

The other ones I know that are decently priced are Castle creations(from ebay US), but still expensive. Believe me, once you start flying, you'll forget logging. Better get yourself a good watt meter as a beginner!

Thank you vinay, I take your advise ....   :hatsoff:


Also i find the TURNIGY 9x backordered, in HK, are there any other stores ? I dint find one..... help please ....  :-\

Just a question, is this the one u were talking abt ? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Castle-Creations-Phoenix-ICE-HV-40A-50V-Brushless-ESC-/280608294802?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item41558ec792

Guys please help me out, most of the TURNIGY items are BACKORDERED, is there any other sites where these are available or it only HK ? I was not able to find any ....

 :help:

Guys can you please let me know which screws should i buys for mounting the motor ? .The link dint have the actual id.

thanks,
merin

Check it out now, I have updated it :) Its 8714

thank you man !!!  ;D ,,,,, i placed order for all other thing.. but not yet shipped  >:( ....

 

It takes 3 working days to ship, and 2 days for tracking to show up and another 3 days to reach India. From there onwards its in customs hands on how fast they can clear it. usually 6 to 15 days to reach bangalore (your shipping address) once it reaches India.

@Vinay, I had the 1st flight today and had a hard landing and the umbrella gears in the tail boom block stripped off. :(     I learn from many other forum that torque tube version has this problem, you should land it nose first , if the tail is hit or hit with lawn grass also the gears are stripping it seems. Can we add this to you original post that for beginers/noobs dont go for Torque Tube version (HK450-ProTT). ? I learnt my lesson :)

Oh, sad to hear that! Yup, the TTs are for those who can safely land the helis. I myself use a belt series if I havent flown for a long time, and then use the TTs.

I assumed that only beginners would read this thread and hence I had given the link to belt series only, Intermediate to advanced would most probably stay away from this thread as neither the Helis mentioned here nor the electronics would be good enough for that kind of flying! Either ways, I will updated the thread. Its a valid point.

gr8  :)

Based on availability, what would you recommend as the best tail servo for a 450 class Heli? I am talking about importing from HK only, though any other cost efficient alternatives are welcome.

Please don't post links of back stock and unavailable items.

http://www.ac-rc.com/product_info.php?cPath=26&products_id=235&osCsid=3tkckl84dnijchf4c3gbmpfop2
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10522

I have used both at some point and they are good for their price

@ VC, the Turnigy DS 480(rebranded MKS) recommended on the first page is also good and cost effective. But they give up after a crash 70% of the time. Since they are not expensive I replace them after a crash. Am not saying 20$ is cheap. But for how good they are, and for how important a tail Servo is for a heli, I feel they are cheap ;) If you are getting into 3D then go for a something raja_mastana recommended. I have not used them but hte specs look good.

I have the below servo but I have not used it. So cant comment. Its supposed to be very very good indeed.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8255 Dont know when they will be back in stock though.

EDIT: the above product seems to be discontinued.

2 queries:

1. If someone tries to mount a scratchbuilt training gear on a basic HK 450 or a Hiller 450, how much should it ideally weigh?

2. Does anyone have a couple of Tail Servos to spare? Even used ones will do.

Cheers!

A word of warning with the HK heli kits. The hex bolts supplied are supposed to be 1.5mm but they seem to be just a fraction bigger. You may find your self rounding either your hex driver's head or the bolt itself. I had to build a dozen 450s and 10 250s last year and found I was going through a driver per heli. If they do round off you can carefully grind them down to fresh metal again to get a little more time using it. With luch you can get two grindings on one driver. I got fed up with buying all types from HobbyKing and Ebay until I found out they were all coming from the same factory. Forget any claims that they are hardened, vanadium or any other fancy name. They are not. They are all the same.

I then bought a couple from the US and I'm happy to say I haven't worn out the first one yet. I got them from www.miponline.com The price was great compared to the cheap and nasty ones. About $7.00 US I think, plus freight which wasn't excessive.

Maybe HK has changed the bolts by now I don't know, but if it's a problem for you then these will fix it.

Regarding the screws, I remember discussing this here long back http://www.rcindia.org/tools-materials-and-building-techniques/hex-driver-set/msg38026/#msg38026 

EDIT: A good thing that you reminded of it. :)

@VC, I just weighed the CF training skid and it was 35 grams with lemon sized sponge balls at the end and aluminium hub at the center. I think you can go easily upto 50 grams. The only problem would be, if you bring the heli down fast, then you may not be able to stop it quickly if its heavier, eventually banging the heli to the ground. And more heavier I used I felt that there was a slow tail drag in one direction along with a tail wag even with a decent head speed. Again I dont have anything to prove the drag and I used to use cheap gyros. This drag/wag used to go off once I removed the skid. Hope this helps  :)

Oh Dear! I do apologize for mentioning something that was mentioned almost 2 years ago. I guess it's possible a few members weren't members that long ago and I doubt anyone would bother to read every post since the site's inception when joining. I guess it does prove my advice was sound :-) Now I'm wondering if I should read every post ever made to make sure I'm not posting something that's already been posted. I'll be back in a few years :-)

Hey Propfella, no need to apologize at all. I am sorry if I put my words in a wrong way earlier and hurt you  :(. My only intention was to link the 2 threads. And yes you were right with the screw size. I myself stripped a lot of screws before I realized the mistake   :banghead:  :giggle:

There is a reason why these landing skids have an angle. A beginner would get scared if the heli goes up quickly and eventually tend to bring it down and bang the heli to the ground. My first crash was in the same way. Thats the reason why training skid manufacturers tend to give an angle as seen in the pic below. It may not be necessary but its helpful. I have seen it helps the heli bounce back into the air if you bring it down fast. If an angle is not possible on a home made skid, then atleast sponge balls at the end should  help. I have kept both HK500 and 450 in the back to give an idea.

Holy Mother of God! No wonder my Heli was going all over the place and just REFUSING to stay in one place. My home made landing skids weighed 150 grams!!! Talk about being a dimwitted noob............ so much to learn.

VC, With the tail drag, I meant there was a change in the yaw axiz AS IF there was a slight rudder input given constantly. Regarding the heli REFUSING to stay in one place - Thats how helis are  ;)


I have the solo pro 180 FBL heli got free from hobbyking during the gift season, and believe me, the moment i lift it up from the ground, it moves away a few feet. Thats a long distance for its size. Some time lower head speed helps keep the heli stable.

Just re weighed the skids. It is 114 grams. If the suggested weight is in between 35 - 50 grams and mine is more than double + the fact that it is not going to be 'perfectly' balanced, it is definitely going to play havoc with the flight characteristics. Just ordered 2 sets of CF skids from dealextreme.com.

I would suggest something like this, you can google for much lower prices if available:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/3D-Big-Training-kit-With-Alum-Metal-Center-For-450-Heli-/180555273285?pt=Radio_Control_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a09eed445#ht_2667wt_1163

If its a plastic hub at the center, they tend to break. Thats why my first crash happened.  >:D There were some comments on this video on another forum that it was my mistake that I pulled down fast. But it was my first day and mistake tend to happen. An aluminium hub is the way to go and will last forever. Now I use the skid for maidens (both 450 and 500 as its strong)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjs9fxb_pes&list=UUZcxL74lW_W2NEq5u9p6kpA&index=6&feature=plcp

My idea of keeping the Training skid light was that you could stop it easily in case you try to come down fast. Nothing wrong in going for a slightly higher weight.

Sounds like you trod on a mouse's tail :-) I'm amazed the 450 is still so popular. It seems to have been around for so long. I can't remember when I first started building them. It took a while but the Hobbyking 450 is just about on par with the actual Align it copied. My last order was for 6 of them and everyone wanted them yesterday. I vowed no more after I finished but then got an order for 6 250s. Luckily that was the time HK sold the kit without electronics for $19.95. The deal was so good I bought an extra 4 250s and 4 450s Just after I finished them off the sale price dropped dramatically and I sold the 250s for $70 fully built with everything fitted ready to fly and the 450s for $80.00 also ready to fly. I then vowed no more helis and now it's all planes.

The only thing I haven't had a go at is the cars and trucks but they are available just about everywhere now. Way overpriced in my opinion. So they are off my shopping list :-) If anyone dared to run one of the nitro trucks around here the police would jump on them for noise pollution. The same reason I have a 5 foot brand new, never been wet 120mph fuel boat and another brand new nitro Miss Budweiser sitting in it's original box. Luckily my electric boats are OK. How are the noise pollution laws in India They are getting worse here almost daily.

We had a guy arrested here a few months back for flying his 500 down the main street with a camera attached. He flew sraight past the police station and wondered why they grabbed him. Silly boy, he didn't go quietly and ended up losing his whole kit.

Noise pollution laws?  :headscratch: What the hell is that? :giggle:  Iam not aware of any such laws. Even if they did exist, our cops are too busy with other stuff.  ;)

Oh BTW, 450s are great. They are cheaper to operate, less dangerous than 500s, more stable than 250s. A sweet point for budget beginners.  :hatsoff:

Not sure if this was posted here earlier, but came across this cool application that will help you configure a HK450 before you purchase it.

hk450-configurator (http://www.rcfan.info/hk450-configurator/)

Ebin

I guess anyone starting out with helis now, should start with flybarless. No use investing in old technology.

what is the main difference between flying a flybarless heli then the heli with flybar.... ???  and which one is the  best  start off with 6ch :-\

Refer this website (http://www.rchelicopterfun.com) which helped me a lot to learn the basics as I am a beginner.

Difference ->Flybar (http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/bell-mixing.html) & Flybarless (http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/flybarless.html)


The flybarless is becoming popular now and the prices are reducing. It is also easy to assemble a flybarless rotor head for a beginner. I am not sure about the flight characteristics as I am not qualified or experienced enough to comment the concerns to a beginner.

I would suggest you read through the following links which I googled (http://www.google.com) for you just to help you once.

Link 1 (http://www.google.co.in/search?aq=1&oq=flybar+or+flyba&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=flybar+or+flybarless+for+beginner)

Link 2 (http://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t552970p1/)

Link 3  (http://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t585931p1/)

Link 4  (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1593249)

Flybar or flybarless ? For me its a personal choice, and I choose Flybar as I want to learn them in deep, how they work before spending time on simulator and then on a real heli.  ;D

Ordered my first heli today :) Though I did some research on the items to order, unfortunately didn't see this sticky before I place the order. The list of items I ordered are these,

Hobby King 401B AVCS Digital Head Lock Gyro   1      
Straight ball link pliers 5mm   1      
HK-450GT PRO V2 3D Belt-Drive Helicopter Kit (Align T-Rex Compat.)
R/C Helicopter Pitch Gauge   1      
450 Size Heli Main Gear Set (2pcs)   1      
450 Size Heli Ball Fixed Ball Linkage Rod Set   1      
HXT900 Replacement Gear Set   2      
HXT900 9g / 1.6kg / .12sec Micro Servo   3      
HK450V2 Pinion Gear 3.17mm 11T/13T (Align part # HZ052 - H45059)   1 (intent to begin with the 11T)      
Turnigy Typhoon 450H 2218H Heli Motor 3450kv (450 class)   1      
HobbyKing HK-922MG Digital Metal Gear Servo 1.8kg/ 12g/ 0.07sec   1      
450 Size Heli Red Tail Blade (pair)   1      
450 Size Heli Yellow Tail Blade (2pairs)   1      
325mm Carbon Fiber Main Blades   1      
HK450 Pro Swashplate Leveler Tool   1      
TURNIGY Plush 40amp Speed Controller   1      

I have couple of nanotec 1800 with me (which I use on my HK YAK55 EPP) to begin with. Am soo excited to have my first heli  (:|~ I hope this is enough for me to begin with. After fiddling with my correHcopter few times, I found out that I could do some basic stuff as well as some flips and inverted flying with T-Rex and other 3D helis on SIM!!! hope that is enough to start with the actual thing  :giggle: I went through the whole sticky and found few items not matching with the suggested setups. Any how, the order is placed and I will have to start with it.

Couldnt keep the Joy (of ordering my first heli) to myself  ;D just wanted to share with you guys.

All the best :)

Thanks Rajath :)

1800 seems kinda small battery and will run out soon. You need to add some weight at the nose to keep it balanced.

Hm.... thanks vinay. I was looking for at least 5 mnts of normal flying. In that case I will use a 800mah 2S with a BEC (which I have handy) for the Rx. That should add the weight and servos wont drain the main battery :) What do you think?

Logically a good idea. But I wouldnt do that considering too much wiring. Feel free to try out what feels good ;)

"feel free to do what feels good" is my other name :giggle: will try it out. Being a beginner 3D (plane) flyer, I hate to add dead weight.

Just ordered these from rcbazaar as spares per advice earlier for shop pickup during my visit.

RZB559   Landing skids - Hiller 450 Pro   1
RZB560   Screws set - Hiller 450 Pro      1
RZB566   Belt - Hiller 450 Pro      1
RZB548   Tail boom - Hiller 450 Pro      1
RZB529   Feathering shaft - Hiller 450 Pro      1
RZB530   Tail shaft - belt version - Hiller 450 Pro   1
RZB562   Links with rods - Hiller 450 Pro

Do I need any thing else? Couldn't find the ball end reamer there :( Guess I have to order from hk and wait.

Just received my 450  (:|~ will build her once am done with the Prox260.

Assembled the pro following "nuttcaze" videos. Whats pending for the frame is the feathering shaft which needs two 1.5 hex drivers ( I had only one  :banghead: ). The other thing I struggled is the head screw that holds the head assembly to the main shaft. Had to use two pliers on both ends to get it out since the 1.5 hex was not a proper fit for it. Managed to put it back after threadlocking rest of the head assembly but not happy with it  as the pliers were slipping, well its a mess :( .

Edit: couldn't do the canopy mount as well since I ddnt have any 1.3mm hex drivers either!

Now, two of the servo installations seems easy and possible while the third one behind the head seems challenging. I guess nuttcaze could have done better  :giggle:

Well, the servo installation went smooth even though I had to remove and reconnect the rods couple of time since I messed up with the channel selections and channel reversals  :banghead: Now all channels except RUD is connected and working fine. Am still not comfortable about the main shaft m2 1.4mm hex screw and its nut.

Now I have to find a way to mount the smaller HK 922 servo on the tail.

Maiden-ed her today with the help of Bilal (friend and fellow flyer). He identified atleast 5 major faults that I made during my setup and rectified them. How ever, as per him it still needs some more work as the head and most other things on it are having major play/slope causing issues especially at lower head speeds.

Video of me flying heli for the first time: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHSe_lIGIo0&feature=youtu.be

Heli Experts, need help  :help:

Though I successfully maiden-ed it (with help ofcourse), still there are issues. The head is having a lot of slope (which is evident more at lower head speeds) causing the heli to dance in its axis. We tried a higher rpm/pitch combo later on and I was able to keep her almost in one place.

The other thing is that while setting her up, we found out that lower part of one of the washout control arm easily comes out. We conducted the maiden as well as my hovering practices using a small normal rubber band wrapped around the linkages. Did any one else face similar issues? how did they fix it? Is ordering Align parts are the only alternative to fix it properly? So many questions...

What do you mean by "head having slop"? Do you mean linkages having slop? The slop (if and) should be independent of rpm/pitch.

If the link comes out easily the heli is probable not flight worthy and potentially dangerous to fly. Rubber band wrapped around any link will lead to binding.

You can check RC Bazaar if you want to buy links :)

Hi Rajath,

The head itself has bit of play. It moves left and right on the main shaft. The heli dances as you could see in the video. Once its idle up or on a higher speed, it steabilizes. I visited and bought some spares from RCBazaar during my last short visit to Bangaluru :) But I dont think I have that washout control rod :( Will have to order now.

Tightness of main blade grip is cause of shaking heli at low rpm..just check your blade grip & Throttle curve..:)
laxman

From the video it looks like you need more head speed on normal throttle curve...look at some throttle curve videos on youtube to get an idea of the 450 heli throttle curve... if you have a programmable radio.

Thanks laxman, I will certainly check the blade grip.But still the slop is there. The head on the main shaft moves at least a milli to both sides if you try with your hand!

if the head is moving up and down on the main shaft just pull it up and tighten the collar on the main shaft so that it stays their.

Hi Hellyflier, exactly... we tried a faster rpm and she was much more stable. But am still worried about the slop. Is it normal for all 450s to have that much slop on the head? or should I think about changing the head? Anyhow, I will be changing the washout control horn.

Nope, the head is moving sideways!

Please demonstrate the slop movement thorugh a video

Sure.. will do tonight. And thanks :)

Here is the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgDxwJ-1mjM

Ok, i think this play between heli head & main shaft, this is a manufacturing defect..

for quick solution..
01 you put thine layer epoxy on main shaft where head fit & fix it & don't forget to wipe out excess epoxy...
02 if play in larger amount you just use aluminum foil paper to fix
03 fill baking soda where need & put one drop ca to fix...
04 for expert advise use R48 anaerobic retainer this will fill 0.01 mm play (use only where metal touch into metal)

for more..check  http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=413823

regrads
laxman

Thanks a lot laxman! I will start from the aluminium foil and if not good enough, then will go the thin layer epoxy way :)

My third flight same day after adjusting the rpm :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNkjAZ1VD10&feature=youtu.be

All the best. Lots of learning to do here :)

Thanks rajath :)

Had my first crash! As per experts watching, one of the HXT900 failed  :banghead: The heli was hovering stable but all of a sudden it twisted itself to one side and kissed mother Earth. I was quick to cut the throttle. The main blades are gone, assume that the feathering shaft is gone too :( , main shaft I have to check. Enough homework for this week :D

But I cant leave with out mentioning this, I ordered couple of spares from rcbazaar last Wednessday for the heli to our Nagpur Office address (am visiting them end of next week), and today I received confirmation from them that the Box is already there!!! What a service!  :salute: to Sujju and his team this time.

Did you check the servos after the crash? Did the servos actually fail?

The Ail servo was not moving after the crash. What saddens me is that rajath, the heli was dead still hovering and I was so pleased at the stability... next moment it goes crazy and goes some what like a quick roll to the ground! I cut the throttle before it hit the ground. And by the way, forgot to mention, the head slop was fixed by tightening the head screw properly. After that it was rock solid and once the blades were re-tracked, it was amazingly vibration free and stable.

Can you please check if it the gears have stripped? :)

Sure will do :)

Rajath, the AIL servo had stripped very badly. Dont know whether this is pre/post crash. All the links were in place and I couldnot find any other reason for the sudden roll of the heli. Had a pack of HXT900 servo replacement wheels and changed them.
Servo re-installed, new cf blades installed, straightened the slightly bent flybar shaft, bent main shaft replaced with an racbazaar Hiller shaft,did a tracking test after balancing the blades and it seems ready for a test flight :)

Get Align DS415M or HS 65MG servos for your cyclic....They are worth their price.

doc

Thanks doc! , I have already ordered Align links to begin with. The original intention to use cheaper items is for the training/learning phase. Didn't wanted to crash expensively ;) Part by part will be upgrading her and the size I intend to go with once comfortable with my flying is 500 or 600. This is also one of the reasons to keep the expense down for the 450. Next up with the upgrade most probably will be the servos :D

Although HS 65MG are rock solid stuff, but it is analog. Get the digital version
OR
get the TGY 306MG - (best VFM)

+1 to raja

You can also give KST servos a go...Hearing good reviews bout them all over the google.

Thanks guys! Appreciate the help. Will keep these in mind :)

Thanks for the info. Guess it pays to use MG servos for cyclic as well.
Does a pro kit demand better cyclic servos?

You only need metal gear servos on cyclic if you are doing tumbles, flips or tic-tocs,  till then plastic gear is just fine and no there is no specific demand for Pro kit it only needs a bigger tail servo, that's it.

Took her to the field but as advised by Bilal (fellow flyer), decided not to fly her as I forgot to change the feathering shaft! Infact I tried earlier but couldn't do it as it requires two quality 1.5 hex from both ends. Though I had two but was slipping :( Ordered two from helikraft as recommended by Bilal. I have seen him using those from helikraft and so far this is the best hex drives I have ever seen for hobby.

http://www.helikraft.com/Tools/RCTAIWAN/RCT0088/Hex-Wrench+Tip+1.5mm+for+RCT0135+%28RCT0088%29.html