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« on: August 09, 2012, 07:47:51 PM »
dheerajjuneja
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Wow, am loving this hobby Smiley

Assembled my first 450 and maiden'd it today, i am feeling very proud of what i have learned in such short period. The heli flew very stable (maidened it in a 8*6 feet space, with minor wind) and the heli looked like its ready to do the rounds pretty well, needs some little work for tail, rest is just "right on spot"

Will post a video tomorrow, thanks to people on this forum to guide a newbie like me.

RCI Rocks!
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« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2012, 09:25:49 PM »
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Have fun Smiley
What setup are you using?
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« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2012, 09:40:30 PM »
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Just today i started building my Hiller 450.Really enjoyable..
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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2012, 11:02:31 PM »
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It seems to be raining 450 helis on RCI Cheesy Guys please post a build/ experience log Smiley
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2012, 11:21:54 PM »
dheerajjuneja
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Hi,

This was my first attempt to build heli, so didn't took any photographs while building, this is something i shall keep in my for future.

However, will post some photographs of how it looks after the build and before I took it out for the first flight in next hour or so.
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2012, 11:25:38 PM »
rajathv8
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I would like it if you post about the problems you face along the way, the setup/radio settings you tired, how it helped and stuff on those lines Smiley
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2012, 11:27:36 PM »
dheerajjuneja
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Thats a very good idea, will post something along that lines too on another day, thanks for the tip to write something on these lines.
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« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2012, 12:07:37 AM »
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Good one Dhreej, I am happy that you are slowly turning into a Heli lover  Smiley
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« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2012, 12:45:52 AM »
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Guys, check the photos:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-l53YGjD4Br4/UCQMn0t9InI/AAAAAAAAAH8/orW_NVkfb8s/s800/HeadTopShot_filtered.jpg
The joy of building a 450


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-bQgQAA8LRVg/UCQMwZmJzUI/AAAAAAAAAIE/jj5OKspO_RQ/s800/HeadFrontShot_filtered.jpg
The joy of building a 450


https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rithhCkP654/UCQM53iZfnI/AAAAAAAAAIM/IIXBiGRVhfQ/s800/MainFrame_filtered.jpg
The joy of building a 450


https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-hHvtRqh2hOo/UCQNBDLMjxI/AAAAAAAAAIU/eufaJpK0EIw/s800/Tail_filtered.jpg
The joy of building a 450


https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-7vB0mcgi4F8/UCQO7H1D1PI/AAAAAAAAAIc/EaoUBOJa4pE/s800/Gyro%2526TailServo_filtered.jpg
The joy of building a 450
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« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2012, 01:28:34 AM »
dheerajjuneja
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Thanks heliflyer, this hobby is eating up my wallet faster than my brains ... But I am still loving it Wink

Btw: all the experienced people here, if you can look at the photographs posted and suggest something, or point out any flaws in the build etc, it would be very helpful. Will post the video of the flight tomorrow.
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« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2012, 08:07:07 AM »
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Quite an impressive job done !! May consider moving the ESC under the heli, instead of the side, just helps the profile look cleaner, also, helps the weight distribution.

Good job !! Welcome to heli addiction  Smiley

Amit K
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« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2012, 01:13:21 PM »
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Thanks Akumar, will try that out.
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« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2012, 01:44:52 PM »
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450 size helis seem to be really taking off... thanks to the Hiller series.  I was pleasantly surprised to be able to assist two newcomers to RC during this trip to Kerala. Both had got 450 size helis (one HK450 and the other a Mini-Titan), and were struggling somewhat with the initial setup. 

Good to see more and more people flying these Smiley
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« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2012, 09:33:30 PM »
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Anwar, Me got the hiller 450 three days after the RC meet. If it was earlier, I too would have come there and seek your help  Smiley
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« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2012, 11:10:37 PM »
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Beautiful pics! Smiley
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« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2012, 01:11:37 AM »
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Hi raja, thanks for noticing that. So many posts followed after the images, without no comments about the photos that I had started thinking they are not in this league Wink
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« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2012, 08:45:11 AM »
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The photos look "professional" !!!!
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« Reply #17 on: August 11, 2012, 09:43:56 AM »
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It may be a good idea to curl the servo wires.  It Will keep the frame area clean Smiley
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« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2012, 01:06:30 AM »
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Yup, that's a good idea too, will try that out, combined with moving the esc below the heli would make the wires almost disappear. Thanks for the tips.
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« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2012, 09:02:23 AM »
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dheerajjuneja , Not sure if we can post links from other forums, but posting a link believing this is an open forum.

These guys have done the best wiring job ! refer to get some ideas

Heli wiring

Ebin
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« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2012, 10:05:29 AM »
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Thanks Ebin, those photos are very good reference points, will definitely try to open my heli and clean up the wiring mess. That should also improve upon the weight balance.
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« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2012, 03:29:27 PM »
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also try to combine 2 wires into one servo protection sleeve to minimise the clutter and get these within the frames...

sujju
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« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2012, 07:03:49 PM »
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I can see 1 long wire in there that may reach the main gear. By the way nice pics!

Sujju, I always had trouble putting wires in those sleeves (those wire mesh) The mesh would keep expanding and unweaving itself as I tried to get the wires in there.
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« Reply #23 on: August 13, 2012, 12:59:43 PM »
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The Video:

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« Reply #24 on: August 13, 2012, 01:22:48 PM »
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Very good..keep..flying
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« Reply #25 on: August 13, 2012, 01:31:47 PM »
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Which model u buy frm rc bazar ?
can u pls send me the settings in gyro / and thx9 radio
settings,


I bought the RTF 450 v2 from RcBazaar, but now apart from the frame, gyro, motor and ESC, rest everything has been replaced from Hiller V2 & HK 450 V2 stuff.

My gyro is giving me severe headaches, in the video also you can see that i have to constantly adjust the nose, as it keeps drifting towards right. The gyro settings need to be setup accordingly to each heli, so i would suggest that you should read more about these and then try to setup accordingly. however  However, my gyro settings in radio are:
Upwards: NOR 80
Dnwards: AVC 100

(Yes, even with gain set to 100, i don't see it working as it should be, and no tail wag)

You can read a quick guide about turnigy setup here:
http://forum.heliguy.com/turnigy-9x-a-quick-and-informal-guide-t60066.html

- Dheeraj
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« Reply #26 on: August 13, 2012, 01:34:50 PM »
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It will usually go away after removing the training skid. I had the same issue with hk401. Also try increasing the head speed slightly and see.

For me I could see the wag only after removing the training skid.
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« Reply #27 on: August 13, 2012, 01:37:29 PM »
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Hi Vinay, ok, at 50% throttle the pitch is set to around 35%, and the heli lifts off at 50% throttle. Should i try to make it such that the heli lifts at around 60% throttle ?
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« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2012, 01:44:07 PM »
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What KV motor and what pinion? I can put it in this way. Keep the pitch curve at -2 -1 0 5 10 and throttle curve at 0 50 80 90 100. At 100 % throttle your HS should be at 2600 RPM. Choose the pinion accordingy or change your Throttle curve accordingly to get those respective head speeds. Too low a HS when hovering will simply drain the battery quick.  Too high and the heli will be agile.
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« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2012, 01:49:44 PM »
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Thats very informative, will try it out with these.

The model was first bought as an RTF (before i reassembled it), will check the pinion and KV and get back.

- Dheeraj
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« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2012, 01:57:28 PM »
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Note that the above settings is what I used. People have their own preferances and you can find yours too. I just followed whatever Anwar bhai told on my thread! Not to drag you away, but I went through the same thing as you went through except that I just had Anwar and Rotorzone to help me back then Wink http://www.rcindia.org/helis/hk-450-mt-build-thread/
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« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2012, 02:56:35 PM »
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Yup, i see what you mean, from the sound of it, it seems it should certainly improve things. Will try these out soon and see how it works. I have already ordered a new gyro, Esc and motor. I read somewhere that some ESC can send lower output to gyro causing it to underperform, though am not sure about it. Will try the new settings before actually tyring to replace the hardware.
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« Reply #32 on: August 13, 2012, 03:03:02 PM »
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I used to slightly trim the heli when it was drifting. And learnt it like that only. The point is to get the training gear off. It may solve a lot of issues.
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« Reply #33 on: August 13, 2012, 03:07:41 PM »
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Smiley yes, getting rid of the training gear is my primary focus as well, will trim the tail and then see, once its stable enough i can then move on to learning orientations ....
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« Reply #34 on: August 13, 2012, 03:10:57 PM »
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Since its a Headlock gyro you have to trim every time the battery is connected. And everytime you land it and take off, be carefull that the tail slider would have moved slightly due to the trim and you have to give a slight rudder input and take off.

Also make sure Revo mixing is off in radio. Its also called as pitch to tail mixing or something.
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« Reply #35 on: August 13, 2012, 03:12:40 PM »
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thanks vinay, this all is getting me too excited, and am at work, not good Wink
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« Reply #36 on: August 13, 2012, 03:14:17 PM »
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Thanks very much vinay for all these inputs though, i think it should make a difference, will update this post as soon as i have some tested this. I am also writing a blog with my experenience in building this one, with the problems i faced and what i did to counter them. Your pointers would definiltly be there ..
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« Reply #37 on: August 13, 2012, 03:14:35 PM »
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Same here. at work Wink All I want to do is help people push their models in the air ASAP. I remember Anwar saying there is more joy in helping than flying. But I barely get time to do that  Sad
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« Reply #38 on: August 13, 2012, 03:39:14 PM »
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Very true, rajathv8 suggested on this thread that i should write up a blog with my experience, thats how i got into writing one Smiley I hope my experiences would help someone to solve any similar issues faster than i was able to.

This forum is very helpful, and vinay you are a god send person, i have a feeling i will be able to sort things out now Smiley
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« Reply #39 on: August 13, 2012, 03:41:13 PM »
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LOL, thats what you will feel till I vanish suddenly for few days due to work.
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« Reply #40 on: August 13, 2012, 03:59:18 PM »
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ha ha ... god help us all then Smiley
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« Reply #41 on: August 13, 2012, 11:39:23 PM »
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@vinay
Why will a low HS drain the battery? And how do you measure HS? Smiley
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« Reply #42 on: August 14, 2012, 02:26:56 AM »
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Heli=Diff parts flying together in close formation



looking at other issues with 450 heli's I think this topic should be re-named as " The joy of building a Good Quality 450"  Grin
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« Reply #43 on: August 14, 2012, 07:51:16 AM »
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Beautiful video. Typical scenario where the kid is curious what their parents are upto ! and the mom has to explain whats happening to keep him distracted and not disrupt the video shoot !!!
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« Reply #44 on: August 14, 2012, 07:53:16 AM »
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Rajath if the head speed is low, you are increasing the pitch to make the heli hover up. This will cause more current drain and heat up the motor and ESC.

Its like starting your bike on 3rd gear instead of 1st. Not a fair comparison at all, but thats all I can think off.

Use a tachometer to measure HS. You can also use the KV of the motor and tooth on the pinion coupled with the throttle curve on your radio. Just google heli head speed calculator. There is a dark horse calculator which is good. this will not be as good as a tachometer but something better than nothing. Wink
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« Reply #45 on: August 14, 2012, 11:06:15 AM »
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Trex 450 DFC



Vinay bro, AFAIK higher headspeed = low flight time
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every 100 RPM less means about 35-40 seconds of extra flighttime at least
from
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=235257
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« Reply #46 on: August 14, 2012, 11:14:44 AM »
vinay
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Oh Ok, then I was wrong  Smiley Good to know that.
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« Reply #47 on: August 14, 2012, 11:19:20 AM »
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Lot of good things coming in this forum, very helpful tips for beginners like me.
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« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2012, 12:00:18 AM »
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Reply to #44 and #45
Yup i thought so too.
Higher the HS, faster the motor rotates, more heat is dissipated by ESC, more power consumption.
Lower HS, higher pitch required, more servo throw, more power.

Since servos consume lower power as compared to motor+esc i feel lower HS should give longer flight time.

@Vinay
Thanks for clarifying Smiley
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« Reply #49 on: September 01, 2012, 03:15:05 AM »
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Heli=Diff parts flying together in close formation



just to add lower HS will also make clumsy cyclic control VS Crisp and quick control of a HHS
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« Reply #50 on: September 20, 2012, 11:08:33 PM »
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Okay, The issue with the gyro is fixed now, the issue was low head speed, increased the head speed by changing the throttle curve and pitch curve and result was a much more stable heli, no sudden changes in altitude and issues with tail hold. All seems to be coming together very nicely now.

Thank you all, my blog is still in writing.
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