RC India

Multirotor becoming very popular nowadays. It's real fun and pleasure to see them flying, however making them at home from scratch is tough job. If you are thinking to make one then this tutorial might help you. You don't need to ask someone or search over forums or blogs to troubleshoot your issue. Here i am trying to put everything together for you. It comes from my personal experience and time i spent searching over google so it might help you to build your multirotor without any hassle. I would like to thank RCGroups, RCIndia and buddies LazyZero, Ron, er9xuser, rajath and roopesh sir for their help and support. Here i will post some basic tips of selecting motor-prop combinations, battery, esc etc.
If you are making it for school, college or university projoct make sure you have enough time for testing and debugging. KK boards are known for plug and play functionality but still fine tuning your multirotor needs time.
I would also like to warn you that don't take multirotor lightly, they are monsters and can ruin your day within seconds. So be careful when you are testing them.
So where to start and how to select parts for multirotor? Here i am trying to put everything step by step.

PURPOSE
Before you start buying parts you should have rough idea, for what purpose you want to make your multirotor? People make them for fun flying and hovering, stunts, AP(Aerial Photography), FPV(First Person View) and Heavy Lifting. You just can't make one multirotor that can do everything for you and if you are completely new to this thing you should first learn hovering and some basics of multirotor flying. So here we assume that we are making multirotor for beginner flying that can probably lift 200-300grams payload so you can hooked up light weight camera for onboard video recording(not FPV) in future.

TYPE, SIZE & WEIGHT OF MULTIROTOR
There are many types of multirotor people make nowadays. Some of them are Monocopter, Twincopter, Tricopter, Quadcopter, Y-6, Hexacopter, X-8, Octocopter. I found that less rotors more precision requires to build them. That's why FPV lovers use hexa or octocopters so if one motor fails, they can safely bring it down to the surface. But more rotors means you have to invest more money. As a beginner quadcopter is good to start. Tricopter is good as well but you will have to deal with yaw mechanism which is tricky if you are building it from scratch. So here we will start with quadcopter. Quadcopter or also called Quadrotor has 4 rotors and it has two flight configurations. X config and + config. In X config two arms will face front side while in + config only one arm will face front side. If you are making Quadcopter with plus config you can tune your quadcopter easily by single axis tuning method which we will learn later. Small and light weight quacopters can do stunts better while big quadcopters can lift heavy payload like cameras with gimbal and fpv gear. So here we assume we are making normal medium size Quadcopter with plus config and 1000-1100grams AUW(All Up Weight) for funflying. AUW includes battery and everything. Basic formula you should keep in mind that weight of multirotor should be half of the total thrust.
Total Thrust = 2x AUW
In short to lift 1000gram quadcopter we need 2000gram thrust. We will learn about thrust later.

FRAME
One of the most important part of multirotor is its frame because it supports motors and other electronics and prevents them from vibrations. You have to be very precise while making it.
ARM:
You can make arm from any material like CF, PVC pipes, Aluminium or Wood but make sure it has enough strength to withstand impact and rough landings. Frame weight should be around 200-250grams. I would recommend you to go with aluminium channels/beams as they are cheap, strong and easily available at any local hardware shop. You can cut, drill them easily at home.
CENTER PLATE:
Ceter plate holds the arms and supports FC, receiver and other sensors. You can use 2-3mm glass fibre, plywood, aluminium sheet or any plastic sheet material but make sure they are stiff, strong and light weight. You can put some holes to reduce weight.
LANDING SKID:
If you want to attach landing skid, buy any RC helicopter landing skid or you can build your own skid from scratch. It's all upto you.
FASTNERS:
Use M3 nut-bolts of different length to assemble frame and motor mount.
SIZE:
There is no thumb rule for size of the frame but for medium size quadcopter 450mm to 550mm motor to motor frame is enough. If your frame is too big compare to your power setup(motor-prop, esc, battery)it will add extra weight while if it's too small props will fight with each other.

Making frame is truly depends on your imagination, skill and availability of material. But it's fun building frame from scratch and you will learn many things from it. If you want to get rid of all these diy things you can simply buy readymade frame from the market but it might put big hole in your pocket. In our case we want to build quadcopter so make sure the angle between two arms is 90 degree and also check that arms are not twisted.


FC(Flight Controller)
There are many FCs out now in the RC world. Some of them are KK, MultiWii, Ardupilot, Naza, Naze, Rabbit, WKM and many other. Advanced FCs have more features and advanced sensors like gyro, accelerometer, sonar, GPS, Magnetometer. But as we know "more power comes with more responsibility and difficulties" so if you are newbie you should start with gyro only. Hobbyking v1, v2.1, v3.0 boards/KK boards have gyro sensor only but still they are best beginner boards in the market to learn and undestand science behind multirotor. So here we are assuming that we are going to use HK board. You can buy any board v1, v2.1 or v3.0. The only difference between them are ATMEGA chip. V1 has 4kb flash memory, V2.1 has 16kb memory while v3.0 has 32kb flash memory. One more reason to use these boards is they are cheap, reliable and easily available at any hobby store. It won't burn your pocket. If you crash and damage your board you can buy another and there are lots of posts and videos available describing how to use them.


MOTOR
One of the important part of multirotor is its motor. It's a part of power system. Infact whole power system depends on selection of motor so you should be very careful while selecting motor. We use Brushless motors for multirotor. Brushless motor comes with some important specifications. You will see these specifications on the page if you are purchasing it online. So it makes our job simple. For motor selection some important specifications are.
kV
Max current(A)
Shaft dia
Thrust
Weight
Lipo(3S-4S)
Suggested prop
For multirotor application 600-1200kV motors are good. Below 600kV even better. Low kV means you can swing big prop. Big prop means it can move more air and you will get more thrust.
kV = RPM/V
If you have 600kV motor and 3S battery to supply power, RPM of of motor at NO LOAD would be
600 x 11.1(3S battery) = 6660 RPM.
Max current rating is another important factor while selecting motor. Selection of ESC and battery depends on this value(we will learn it later). It should be able to run on both 3S and 4S lipo battery. Shaft diameter helps you selecting prop adapter. Now we are coming to the thrust. In most cases you will see value of the thrust motor can produce with suggested prop on the website. If you remember we learned that to lift 1000 grams quadcopter we need total 2000grams of thrust. And quadcopter has 4 motors, so each motor should be able to produce atleast 500grams of thrust to satisfy our need.
4 motors x 500grams thrust = 2000grams thrust.
One more thing is Watt.
Watt = V(Voltage) x I (Ampere)
More Watt more power so you should also consider that while selecting motor.
But when it comes to selecting motor you will notice that there are many options available for motor selection and it's really confusing, so which motor is best for multirotor application? Well you should consider few more things other than specifications. Some of them are
Motor Mount: Well motor mount is one more important factor you should keep in mind while selecting motor for your multirotor. Motor mount comes under tensile force especially when you are swinging big prop and if motor is not fitted properly it might come off during flight and i am sure nobody wants to see such things happen. So make sure that motor you are purchasing has good mount that can hold motor properly under heavy load and same way you can fit that mount easily on the frame. However you should always precheck before flight that all connections and fastners are properly fitted. Get one spare motor. So i hope i have covered everything for motor selection.

PROPELLER
We always neglect this plastic piece. Just because it's cheap? Who knows!! But in multirotor application contribution of prop is remarkable. Specifications of prop are easy to understand and they are dialmeter and pitch. Type of prop is important as well but we will see effect of diameter and pitch on flight of multirotor. Generally we see prop with the specification of
7x3.5
8x4.5
9x5
10x3.8
10x4.5
10x6
11x4.7
12x3.8
First value is diameter of prop and second value is pitch. Both are in inches.
Diameter: Virtual circle that prop generates.
Pitch: Amount of travel per revolution.
As we see above our motor runs at 6660 RPM at NO LOAD. But when you mount prop on it, RPM will be reduced. Here we will take example of two props 10x3.8 and 10x6. When you mount 10 inch diameter prop RPM of motor will be reduced to 3600 RPM (Revolutions Per Minute).
60 Revolutions Per Second.
Our 1st prop has 3.8 inch pitch. Means per revolution it will travel 3.8inch. So
60 x 3.8 = 228 Inch/Sec = 5.7 m/sec
For 2nd prop, it has 6 inch pitch.
60 x 6 = 360 Inch/Sec = 9.1 m/sec
So we can say if we have 10x3.8 prop our quad will climb in the air at 5.7 m/sec, while with 10x6 prop climb rate will be incread to 9.1 m/sec.
Bigger dia prop can produce more thrust.
So which prop is best for our multirotor?
Generally you will get suggested prop value in motor specification, so you should go with it and buy 1-2 pair extra. But what if prop value is not given. You will see kind of table with different props, Volts, Amp, Thrust and Efficiency. Here you will have to try trial and error method. But it doesn't mean you swing 13x3.8 prop on 1700kV motor.
Lower kV motor can deal with bigger prop. With increasing kV value size of prop will be decreased. So you will have to keep this in mind. For multirotor you should go with low pitch prop if you need more stability and less vibrations. How to balance prop? We will see in next part.

ESC(Electronic Speed Controller)
ESC supplies power from battery but not constant, it varies according to input signal. ESC also has BEC(Battery Eliminated Circuit). BEC is nothing but 5V output from ESC that can power up receiver, servomotor(for camera gimbal) and FC. But how to select ESC for our multirotor? Well it's really simple. You only need to keep in mind that Ampere rating of ESC should be higher than max amp rating of motor. For example the motor we selected draws maximum 15Amp so your ESC rating should be higher than 15amp. Say 18-20Amp. Still confused? Here is simple forumla. Thanks to Sai sir(rcforall) of RCI.
ESC = 1.2-1.5 x max amp rating of motor
1.2-1.5 x 15 = 18-22.5A
So you can select ESC between range of 18A to 22A. But please note it's note thumb rule. You can go with either 18-20A or 25A (it might be bit over powered). Whichever ESC you choose make sure it has programing facility(throttle range, battery mode etc). Go with quality ESCs check user reviews and buy 1 spare.

BATTERY
This beautiful monster eats quality food. If you don't feed them they refuse to fly. So how to select battery for your multirotor?
For that maximum Amp rating of motor comes first. If you remember our motor draws max 15amp. We are working on quadcopter and it has 4 motors, so all 4 motors will draw
4 x 15amp = 60Amp.
Now let me explain few specifications of battery. You will see them on battery and website as well.
mAh
C discharge rating
2S, 3S or 4S.

mAh:
1000mA = 1A
You can compare mAh rating of battery with petrol tank of your vehicle. Big tank more petrol you can fill and more you can drive. The same way more mAh rating gives you more flight time.
C Discharge Rating:
Maximum current(A) at which battery can be discharged at particular time.
1S, 2S, 3S & 4S
1S = 1 cell of 3.7V
2S = 2 cells in parallel x 3.7V = 7.4V
3S = 3 cells x 3.7V = 11.1V
4S = 4 cells x 3.7V = 14.8V
4S means more power than 3S. If you remember we discussed that
Watt = V x I
Here we are increasing value of Volt so watt will be increased. Our motor draws max 15A. So watt value for 3S and 4S will be
At 3S battery 11.1 x 15 = 166.5 Watt
At 4S battery 14.8 x 15 = 222 Watt
but make sure your motor and esc are capable of handling 4S.
Generally you should go with 3S battery only.
Now as we know we need atleast 60A current. So here we will take example of two batteries.
2200mAh 25C
2200mAh 40C
Which battery is good for our multirotor? Let's see
2200mAh = 2.2A
2.2 x 25C = 55A
2.2 x 40C = 88A
We need atleast 60A so 2200mAh 40C is good for us. Go ahead and get it.

I hope you have gathered enough confident to build your own multirotor from scratch. Next part will be even more interesting. So stay tuned.

Please note i am not an expert but recently i went through this process and i would like to share my experience with multirotor lovers so they can build their own easily. If something wrong feel free to edit, delete, correct. I will post next part soon.

Here is me flying one.  Real fun!..... this hobby once it bites you.  Patience is the key and love for  flying.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NELOVSniVqw

good stuff bro {:)} {:)} :thumbsup:

Good summary of the tons of info out there! Great for noobs. Perhaps this can be expanded into a full scale "multirotors for dummies" and made a sticky?

Dharmik, thanks a ton! Lots to learn from this. Not only for Quads but in general about RC and its related components. Please continue posting. This thread is a good learning platform for all individuals who are recent entrants or are contemplating on taking up this hobby.


Dreamfly - awesome video and GREAT flying. Please post details of your Quad.

nice flying sir.subscribed this thread.

hi,  
My setup
4 aluminium square tubes ( ~50 cms motor to motor)
4 DT Motors 700 kv
25 amps turnigy esc (plush)
2200 30 - 40 C turnigy lipo
openpilot board
Props = APC 1045.  I havent used the HK 1145 as yet.  will post the results soon.
Lots of wires = making it a mess (need to find some time to streamline this)
Landing gear = small bamboo sticks
controller mount = Used CD
AUW = 1200 gm (Got to keep it as light as possible for extended flight times)  I get around 5 -6  mins of continuous flying


BTW how do I paste a pic?
Ah Not to worry I found it.
Here's the Pic of my dreamfly.  Pretty "Ugly" isn't she?   ;D

Thank you staya, vineet and krish bros and VC sir thank you so much, it means a lot. Dreamfly sir i saw your youtube channel. You have some fantastic on board videos, i loved it. Your son is your inspiration because i see him in allmost every vid. So what's your next plan? Get hd camera and take us to beautiful location.

That's the idea and that's why I am practicing hard whenever I get the time, mostly on weekends. Last week I flipped when landing and broke a prop. I don't have any more spares left.  :o  My son just likes to be around when I fly.  he has his own small co-axail copters which he flies with authority.  I am sure he is going to go up to be a Lil master one day.  Its just too dangerous to be flying a Quad at this time.  I have been cut twice with the Props.  These APC are razor sharp and you don't even know when they cut you.  No Stitches so far...... ;)
Does anybody know who sells APC props in india?

Nice summary Dharmic. Good info too. and great efforts.
In Multirotors, for the good stability and fun, it is very important to reduce the vibration. So it may be a good idea to stress this point. It makes a huge difference. (There is a lot of difference from flying and flying with stability, just like planes.)
For beginers with out heli experience, there is a lot to learn in flying. and few crashes are inevitable. To reduce the damage and cost
it may be a good idea to start with 70- 100w low KV motors and max current  12- 15 A, 1300, 3 cell, 25 to 30C
and ofcourse a light frame. AUW of say max 700 grams
I our conditions, breaking one prop means the whole Multi is down for weeks, so it is very important to save props. Keeping the frame length by atleast 1/2 a prop more can save props in most cases.
ashta

Thanks for that advice Ashta,  I think that's a very good idea to either extend the length of the frame by slightly more than 1/2 a prop.  I have to re-do this thingy again.  I think I must have assembled this a hundred times already, either trying to add something or remove something. (I think that extension could have saved my prop when it flipped!!)  All in all it gives you new ideas all the time to make your quad a better flyer.

@dreamfly: Woow! That's one heck of a quad! :hatsoff:
BTW, what props are those? APC?

Thanks. and yes those are APC

Thank you ashta sir and anwar sir.
@dreamfly
I have been looking for that prop but couldn't find anywhere. Currently i have 10x4.5 props bought from rc4all. They are really strong.

Dharmik  which props are those? and how much did u buy them for?  can u post a pic please

Here is the pic sir(you can see scratches everywhere). I bought 3 pairs and till now i broke only one when i dropped my quad upside down from 15-20 feet, i don't know exact height but when it dropped i heard horrible sound. When i saw my quad at crash site i lost hope to see it flying again because damage was too much. All 4 motor shafts were bent, one motor bell was deformed, metal cover of roll gyro was disappear, yaw was bent as well as frame. Somehow i managed to repair things and now it flies fine.

same thing happnd with me but luckily only arms bent nothing much as it has crashed on a grassy field.. :D lucky me :D

Here is that crash summery
Green dot = start point
Blue dot = hovered for more than minute
Sky blue dot = i killed throttle and raised again and it jumped into air above trees
Yellow dot = lost orientation
Orange dot = panic started
red dot = crashed on concrete floor

Sorry to hear that, but it's just amazing how u got things sorted out.  I mean that in itself is a feat!  How did you get he deformed bell back into shape?  Also the Shaft?

The reason I asked about the prop was I seem to have that same prop which I bought from HK along with the motors,  I broke 2 props while trying to tune the Quad.  I somehow feel there is a lot of vib being created with this prop.  I need to try once more after balancing them.  The ones I have are 1145. 

APC props are available at rotor.co.in and beyondtoyz.in , but limited choice. I plan to buy directly from apcprop.com in the future. They have CW+CCW multirotor combo props too.

looks like the only choice we have in India at this point in time.  Thanks for the info "hyd"

@dreamfly: You've made an amazing quad from dt700s (or 750s?) I have almost the same config, about the samw AUW 1190g and an FC which has ACC in addition to GYROS, but mine doesn't fly that great. I know the reason: I mounted the motors with the downwards-protruding shaft touching the beam beneath and ran the setup many times. That was how my motors got degraded in performance. Then, the thing began flying at last (after correcting the gyro-orientations), but crashed from 10ft and my motors seem to be needing a replacement.
So, I want to ask you what you feel about dt700s/750s. Do you feel their build quality can sustain a small crash?
Thanks,
Vineet

Vineet,
DT 700 motors are good since I have not tested any other motors. May be for my next quad I should try out a different brand/type other than a bell.
When u say your quad doesn't fly that great! what do you acutally mean?  
Can u post a video?  
What is the controller u are using at present?  
have u tuned the PID settings?  
What is your Motor to Motor distance?
Have u centered your battery on the Quad so that the CG is ok.  If the CG (Center of Gravity) is not Ok then you will have to struggle with the sticks a lot in trying to keep the quad stable in a hover, but for crazy/sport flying you dont have to bother about the CG too much.

Initially I had the same problems that you had.  The dt's also have the opposite end of the shaft slight protruding.  So we have to accomodate those on the frame by either drilling appropriate holes or by using motor mounts.  I make my own mount with small pieces of plywood.  So far I have wasted quite a number of frames.  Part of the learning phase I guess.  Just remember this doesn't happen in a day. But just dont stop trying.

Thanks for the reply. :)

By "it doesn't fly great" I mean it's so sluggish! It disappoints me and it feels like it has got the senility of the entire world in it.
I tried increasing the RC rate both on my Tx and my CRIUS MultiWii FC. I increased the throttle PID attenuation.
And the throttle curve is almost perfectly linear on my Tx. Yet my quad is very slow and... uncontrollable on the roll axis.

Yes, the build is poor, perhaps. The CG is not perfectly situated at the geometric centre.
The motor to motor dist. is around 570mm.
I use the CRIUS MultiWii FC with firmware v1.9 in it. v2.0 is released but I don't wish to change it now.
I'm currently working on my second quad, as I have learnt a ton from my first quad. I am confident that I can build 10x better now.
Thanks,
Vineet

I think what you should do is try with the default settings and then work your way up/down. 
you say your quad is uncontrollable on the roll axix.  What does your GCS show on graph regarding the roll.  Are they showing crazy readings.  May be your roll axis gyro is the culprit. Maybe.   

Thanks dreamfly. I tried fiddling with the PID values for the roll axis. I started with P at a MIN vlaue and started working my way upwards (I heard P "fights motion"). No luck yet. And, I always used to fly with the ACC switched off (stable mode disabled). I figured that out only recently and enabled the safe mode. It flies the same way: uncontrollable and sluggish...
Thanks,
Vineet

do you have inner loop and outer loop in your config settings?

normally you have to give both the picth and roll almost the same valuse.  If not then I believe that you have a faulty roll gyro.  I am telling this with the experience I had on my flight controller.
Does the GCS show proper reaction to your movements?  Why done you post a video.  it might be better to understand your problems

@dramfly
Sir all i did is took the shaft, rolled it on flate surface to check from where it got bent. Took hammer
One gentle hit
Inspection
Gentle hit again
Inspection
It took two days to get them fixed.
@to all members
I found more newbie guides. More and more people sharing their experience. Please check
http://polakiumengineering.org/?p=1520
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1679976

Dharmik, So you are now flying the quad without any vibes?

Yeah sir i don't see any effect of damaged motors. I have balanced props again and it flies great. I will get it on video soon.

@dreamfly: Thank you. I believe the gyros are OK, for the movement of the quad is perfectly reflected in the GUI. I'll surely post a video when I'm done. :)

Vineet

That will be great Vineet.  btw do you know where the other members post their videos of them flying.  I don't know how to find them

I'm afraid I didn't understand that. But most of them must be posting videos in their build-logs itself. Like:
http://www.rcindia.org/multirotors/help-with-my-quad/msg98730/#msg98730 (http://www.rcindia.org/multirotors/help-with-my-quad/msg98730/#msg98730)

Thanks,
Vineet

Yes that's exactly what I needed to view the other members flying videos and builds.  Anyway we seem to have a small community in the multirotor category but growing for sure!

Guys where is the TUTORIAL?

Krish bro it's on 1st post. I am composing 2nd part. Hope you would like it.

@dreamfly
Sir any plan to build one more quad? Have you seen juz's videos? He is also using openpilot fc with ht fpv frame.

@Dharmik
I have a centerplate for a Tri and all the Aluminium tubes but not really finding the time to put them together.  I have to really manage my time and see if I can get one up in the air soon.  Too many activities happening these days and not really finding the time to fly.

Oh yes, juz, Enthlapy, and a few others are realy good flyers. and not fogetting "Worthox" He is just a guru at flying Quads

Yes, I love warthox's videos, too. I follow his vimeo channel regularly. His "1.2KW MWC Quad" is a must watch.

Vineet

hey Vineet.  How's your troubleshooting coming up with your quad?

Thanks,
Right now I'm building a lighter and more symmetric frame. My frame weighs 300g+ and is way out of symmetry. I think that should be causing the automatic drift and other problems. :)

Vineet

oh yes. That's very important I think but on the other had when I look at some of the other quads with their symmetry seriously in question, I really begin to wonder how these quads really work ;)

What do you recommend as a central 'plate'? I used aluminium, but now I am building it with something similar to fiberglass. (the translucent examination pads).

Actually you can use anything that is regid to hold the frames in place without bending.  I use 3mm plywood but need to look at something better.  How's the fibreglass material to work with?  Plywood is quite easy to cut.  I used the services of a laser cutter.

here is the video of my Quad. My controller is very similar to Cirius Multi Wii but with more features like, Built in USB, and FETs put on free pins of the Atmel 328 and brought out to pins for LEDs relays etc.,  Built in Battery monitor and Buzzer etc.
I was trying the Altitude hold in front of my house.
At 1.24, 1.38,2.34,3.54,4.22,5.37 u can see me holding the Xmitter free. I was shooting with my crude capcam
http://youtu.be/if3N_WVzIHM

Mr. Ashta,  This definately calls for a get-to-gather with you at try out your board.  I cannot view your video since I am at work and youtube is blocked.  Will view it this evening at home, But so far I am completely overwhelmed by your dedication to your hobby.  Anytime you are free, I would like to come and do some flying with you Sir! 

thank you and welcome Dreamfly. I live in BTM lay out. Where do you live? u can come home any day. you can call me at 9448073127.

Thanks Mr.Ashta for inviting me over to your place.  Lets' try and chatch up this weekend if nothing else happens to come in our way.  I have saved your Mob no.  I'll call u.

@Ashta
Wonderful sir. In auto-level it flies really smooth. Are you using helmet cam?
@dreamfly
Never heard about Enthlapy sir
@hyd_quads
Which motor you are planning to use it? please don't forget to update us.

Dharmik,  Please upload some pic of your quad.  I would like to see the material we use in india for centerplates.  I want to use something very light and strong and below say 50 gms.

where can I purchase carbon fiber hollow tubes with motor mounts in india?  Going in seach of stuff when u don't even know what to ask in hardware shops in india is a real challenge.  The sellers dont even want to speak to you. >:(

thanks dharmic.
i used my crude cap camera
http://www.rcindia.org/electric-planes/crude-hat-cam/

carbon fibre rods tubes
http://www.rcdhamaka.com/index.php?main_page=index&zenid=1c3hq8bmjh4s383cqnsdsotdu1&cPath=56&sort=20a&filter_id=&alpha_filter_id=67

for centre plate
1. 1.2 mm glass epoxy sheest avaia;ble from PCB vendors
2. Poly carbonate roofing sheet
3. Light 3mm ply

Thanks Sir,  also liked your cap camera idea. 

I plan to use NTM propdrive 2826 315W motors (most probably 1000kv, else the 1350kv ones). Thanks.

Just Completed another round of flight.  videos posted

http://youtu.be/qBTNUoJnlfE

http://youtu.be/eaZrhSEBpZ8

@dreamfly
Sir sorry for being late, i have posted my build log in DIY section. It was like roller coaster ride. I would like to ask you that how do you maintain orientation?

I just trust the board I guess.  But jokes apart, I guess I am in for a crash soon.  I just dont want it to happen on someone.  Dharmik, I think it's about practicing and tuning. That's what I do most of the time on the weekends.  I haven't flown a plane for if I had then orientation would be easy.  If you notice I too am learning how to actually fly like Mr.Ashta.  He is indeed a very good flyer.  I really still dont have the guts to do a nose inward flying.  That my next goal.

This might also help in orientation.  It actually helped me at night

http://youtu.be/Gkjnh7CHNzo

What do you all think about my new scratch-built frame? Built of aluminium two-channel pipes and a fiber central plate. Weighs just 270g. Didn't get any idea about the landing gear yet.
How vibe-resistant will it be? (I'm going to mount the motors using zip (cable) ties ).
Thanks,
Vineet

That looks sweet.  So the total frame weight is approx 300 gms + 350 gms (motors) + 160 gms (esc's) + 200 gms (lipo) = 1000 gms approx.  Not bad
Why are you mounting your motors with cable ties?  do you feel or heard it's better at reducing vibs?

Vineet, did you paint those aluminium pipes brown or they are sold that way?

Thanks for the instant reply. :)
I didn't paint them. un-painted pipes were available, but I bought these so that the paint insulates and prevents any short-circuits. I am mounting using cable ties because the usual nut+bolts available at my local hardware store are heavy. (the slot/flat ones) These bolts contributed around 70g to my last quad. I'm looking for lighter ones, like the philips nuts and bolts sold by HK. I didn't like the idea of using cable ties, myself. BTW, I estimate it to be < 1000g.  Thanks,

Vineet

I use 3mm SS bolts and nuts.  The length can vary based on your fitments

for example the 3mm nut and bolt 5cm lenght I use weighs 4gms each

and hey I ddn't think of the insulation.  You see we have something to learn from each other all the time.  I need to start painting mine.  Thanks for that idea.

Yes every build says something.
@dreamfly
Sir that night flying is awesome. I agree FC plays important role. I have spent more than a month practicing on FMS and now i can hover my quad fine but honestly i can't fly like you and Ashta sir. Hmm.. I have something running in my mind but i am waiting for my KK2 board to arrive.
@Vineet bro
Man that frame is more than perfect! I can see your hardwork, no doubt about it. Your half work is allready done. I can guarantee this quad will fly like a dream. Yes painted arm adds beauty and safety. Now you will have to update us. I am really excited to see that thing flying. I have wrapped color paper on arms. 3 black 1 red.

Thanks Dharmik,  Which FC are you using?  Well I don't plan to do the night flying too often.  I think my eyesight aren't too good cause a couple of times I lost focus and my heart was in my hand. With quads you cant afford to do that.  The light breeze was also a deterrent. 

what's an FMS?

Oh I gues it stands for some Flight ***** Simulator.  Honestly I didn't use a simulator and broke a lot of props in the process.  Do you know where I can download a siumlator for free????

I didn't figure that out before I noticed sparks.  :rofl:

You can get a free sim here: http://www.realflight.com/free-rf6-demo.html

I have that sim but I'm having a problem hooking up my Tx to that.
Plus, not all sims have a quadrotor. I heard the new Phoenix sim has a quad. I don't think it'll be free.
BTW, thanks for the suggestion about nuts and bolts. :hatsoff: Yours are pretty light...

Vineet

PS: I'm attaching a screenshot of Realflight 6 demo.

Oh, thank you so much Dharmik bro. :)

Hey Vineet, If you have some problems with the bolts and nuts, I can send you some 4mm non-ss.  Do you want some?  and thanks for that link.  let me see what I can get from there.

4mm  3 cms in length

@dreamfly i think u have move from open pilot to Dji - WooKongM
configure the IOC u can fly kilometers away from the home point,,,,

@dreamfly
Sir it's Flying Model Simulator. Here is the link
http://modelsimulator.com/
It has quadcopter and Y-6 models available.
@Vineet
Is there any time restriction in RF6 demo version?

@ Dharmik: no, there's no time limit, but I'm unable to connect my tx.
Thanks for the link, I'll try fms. :)
@ dreamfly: Thanks a lot for the offer :salute: but it's pretty uneasy to trouble you for nuts and bolts... I'll try a little more and will ask you if I can't get any. Thanks.

Here are quadcopter models for fms sim
http://home.comcast.net/~scarzvanetten/fms/dfvti.zip

http://home.comcast.net/~scarzvanetten/dfx6.zip

http://home.comcast.net/~scarzvanetten/fms/df-xpro.zip

Hemanth Bhai,  I have a dji Naza but.........  Still fly the Openpilot.  I dont know why.  There is a lot of fine tweaking you can do on the openpilot and I guess that's something I really want to play with. I fly the Naza occassionally. I hope you understand what I am trying to say.  No doubt the naza is a fine controller and almost absolutely no tweaking necessary,  But you ask a Computer nerd if he would rather use "Windows" and not linux,,,, and you wont like what he might say to you.  But for a newbie I must say it's a very nice controller with nothing really to tweak and can get up to speed in no time but ofcourse at the higher price tag.   This is my personal view ofcourse. 
  
Dharmik Bhai,  Thanks for thet link I'll downlaod and check it out

Vineeth Bhai,  No problems  "Ask anytime"  

Thank you sir. Here are more HEXA, OCTO, QUADRO models
http://svn.mikrokopter.de/listing.php?repname=Projects&path=%2FFMS-Modelle%2FZIP%2F&#A752e684c35a388367f5e03578f201bae

@dreamfly i hope dont get any stream error while flying with openpilot and has long as u don't have any costly equipment in ur multirotor...

Great links Dharmik bro. It's on download now. :)

Wow Dharmik Bhai,  That's  a nice link of Mikrokopter.  Will go thru in my spare time. Thanks once again.

@ Hemanth bhai,  What's Stream Error?  So far I have not encountered any errors but may be this is something I should be aware of.

Thank you friends,
I tried real flight 6 sim. They have disable tx support in demo version, only keyboard and it's really hard to control model using keyboard.

Yeah, I thought that too. I've been playing (not using) it since 3 months on keyboard and now it's quite easy. But using a keyboard doesn't help much, the purpose of using a sim is not served - to get used to the sticks.

@dreamfly ur esc with get no or max ppm in air....so this totally ruin ur quad and dji naza or wkm are the only controllers free of it that too 99% only....so try and pwm isolator cricuit to make ur system 100% bullet proof...

Hemanth bhai,  I have not understood this, Kindly elaborate.   What's a PWM isolator?  I definately would like to make my quad not die up in the air while flying.

Finally Caught up with Mr.Ashta over the weekend and I was pleasantly surprised at how much effort and time he spends at this hobby he loves.  A lot to learn from him.  He gave me a lot of tips and I even got to fly his baby  "his personally designed multiwii board". (Given the time he would have even built the motors and ESC's). I think it flies beautifully even with the board off balance on the frame which I later noticed and pointed it to him.  He himself is a very confident flier in a confined space and I can imagine what he would/could do with open spaces.  He is also not confied only to Quads but also builds and flies a whole array of fixed wing aircrafts.  I was so stunned at his collection that I had taken a camera and completely forgot to shoot some pics which I would have posted on this forum.   Thank you Mr.Ashta.  I salute you!  and hoping to meet you soon once again.

Thanks Roland for coming home.  and spending time. As you have not visited Hoskote, we will go one day together.

I am new to quads. Can someone please throw some light of propellers needed.
What kind of props are needed for a quad to work?
What is RH rotation? Is it the same CCW?

Thanks

Well you need both CW and CCW rotating props. RH (Right Hand) rotation means CW rotation props

That helps, thanks

:thumbsup:

Thanks for extending yet another invitation Sir.  I'll surely join you if and when I am free.  Thanks once again.  we'll be in touch.

i got following setup
750 kv rc electro motor
25a red brick
i86 board
q450 frame

when it fly it goes backwards. i have tried trim but it didnt work well. i have seen people tuning with a jig or strings. can some one guide about tuning with string method?

hi @karandex,  Which FC are you flying it with?  Based on the FC respective users would be able to help you.

hk i86 its clone of eagle n6. mems gyro. its gain change only. it seems i need to increase the gains and it occilates i should decrese it

All quads do occilate at slow speeds.  it's only at high speeds that they begin to level.  Can you post a video?

i am afraid to fly it. i broke 3 props today. it did get into air but it was moving in random directions.i think i should try with pot incresed.

buy some cheapo props.  Breaking props is part of the game plan here while you learn how to fly.  I would suggest you fly outdoors or in big halls to learn.  Don't try to fly in small confined areas... and dont be afraid to fly!  These things take time to learn.

@dreamfly:

Where did you buy APC props? apcprop.com or any LHS? Thanks,

Vineet

I bought them from Tower hobbies in the US.

Thanks. :)

Eagerly Waiting for your next post

And so I had fun over the weekend with my quad and a lot of cheer leaders around me to go higher which I did eventually,  Proof:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUnhBCC40GE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WnU7jLXouYo

@dreamfly what is the prop that you are using with your motors? have you share buildlog of your quad here on RCI?? I am planning to use DT750 on my quad and have 1047 props what do you suggest is that good. My quad weights about 1100gms - 1200gms including every thing (battery also)

hey satya bhai,  My setup:

4 aluminium square tubes ( ~50 cms motor to motor)
4 DT Motors 700 kv
25 amps turnigy esc (plush)
2200 30 - 40 C turnigy lipo
openpilot board
Props = APC 1045.  I havent used the HK 1145 as yet.  will post the results soon.
Lots of wires = making it a mess (need to find some time to streamline this)
Landing gear = small bamboo sticks
controller mount = Used CD
AUW = 1200 gm (Got to keep it as light as possible for extended flight times)  I get around 5 -6  mins of continuous flying


 

I have posted some pics of my quad on the very first page. please have a look there

Wonderful videos sir.

Thanks @Dharmik bhai

I see GPS module attached sir. Are you using naza now or OP has gps facility?

I have used both the naza and OP.  The GPS pole is permanently fixed and it takes time to undo.  So I don't bother to remove it  The naza is sturdy and very slow (less enjoyment!!)  The op can be tuned for however you want to fly it just like any other opensourse FC's out there .  The only difference is that with the naza absolutely no tuninig is actually necessary so very helpul for people who want to experience the thrill of flying after failing!  but after some time just like an automatic car you get bored!  cause nothing to tune or tweak. 

Yes bro i did saw the pics and they look nice. Where did you got APC props from?? LHS or HK site? any link will be helpful

Towerhobbies

I tested my quad yesterday at very low throttle and I was glad to see it hovering at just 20% throttle. But it has a LOT of clock-wise yaw. It rotated @ 1rev/7seconds during the test
I ignored, set the trims and went flying today. I went up to 45% (or so) throttle. It went spinning up in the air like a top (about 1rev/3 sec !). Eventually after going up till 10m, it began drifitng leftwards and since that was my first >5s flight, I was a little tensed. It was about to land on the terrace of a G+1 house (I couldn't control it), but there were 5-6 electric and telephone cables right in the front. And alas! The quad got struck in the wires and fell down right from there. I had 4" foam beneath as landing gears, but it fell upside-down (of course, that is expected). All props broke and arms bent. :(

The unnecessary yaw is an outcome of bad trims (my Tx with analog trims sucks!)and meaningless PID values. I guess I can handle that but can anyone suggest me how to avoid loosing props in the air? This has happened several times too. My prop savers are way too loose and they came out twice in mid-flight (2m high, luckily). I've just ordered JY type prop adapters from RCB anything more I can do?
Thanks,
Vineet

vineet bro try not to gain too much height, i know once it goes up we cant control it (atleast while we are testing it) i have broken lots of props while testing. The best thing that i do is fly in park that i have around here, lots of grass so you get nice cushion. I can give you couple of more suggestions if you can share images of the current quad (after crash) right now quad that i am working on is version 3 :giggle:

I flew where there were patches of grass, but that's not a problem because I used 4" thick foam under the quad, but if it happens to fall from a height, it falls upside down. :banghead:
And I am unable to make it fly at low height, it either stays at 1-2m or goes to 10m. I'll try smoothening the throttle curve which is quite steep now. Thanks,
I'll upload some pics later. :)

btw, reworking a crashed quad is indeed a painful and sucking job! I have updated the firmware and want to go flying now, but.... yes a but to give pain in the BUTT! :giggle:

Hey Vineet bro was that firmware/ issue?

I was running a pretty old version (v1.9). RCGers said v2.0 and v2.1 have got some new features + a better GUI. And I too didn't see a reason for not updating. My board has got a reveresed yaw direction, need to change that in the firmware too. :)

Mine too fell upside down and broke hk board, prop and frame during first outdoor test. I hope your fc and motors are fine. It hurts and repairing takes ages.

yeah, repairing is indeed taking time. Luckily my motors and FC are fine. My scratchbuilt frame is bending every time it falls, yet I selected the strongest and lightest I could find. I'm inclined towards buying a frame for my next quad. :(

vineet the problem is we dont look for all aspects, with aluminum arms bending is inevitable, it does gives you very light weight be sturdiness goes away. Thats y after failing with 2 quad frames i choose to go with CF frame...

Satya bro be careful with CF. They are not good for health. Wear mask.
http://www.protechcomposites.com/pages/Working-With-Carbon-Fiber.html

Hi satyagupta. Did you switch to carbon fiber arms as well? or only the central plate?

Vineet

Well Folks the inevitable finally happened!!!!!. Had my first major crash.  Major in the sense I actually caused physical damage to a boy!  Had to rush him to a hospital and 8 stitches later.......  Gosh.
My wife has banned me from flying on my rooftop.    It was entirely my fault.  Didn't know what this "Flying Blender" can do.  Very irresponsible of me. 
Damage to the Quad. 
1. Bent arms
2. 2 Broken props
3. A damaged esc.   
Well not at the cost of causing physical injury to anybody.   Please fly safe guys.  I am still yet to get over the trauma!!!!!  Will post a video soon

OMG sorry to hear that sir. Your son got hurt?

This is very sad, please guys be very careful about this, speciality when kids/minors are around. You should ask them to stay at a very safe distance and if they don't listen then its better to pack your bags for the session.

@dreamfly, I don't think posting the video is a good idea. One formal complain and the whole community could be done for good.

I understand bro, once i had my quad crashed over my wife (she was shooting it) she could not understand and the quad came down crashing over her. Good thing, that the props stopped spinning and she got a small cut on her finger but indeed it is very dangerous.

About kids you really cant do anything to keep them away, shout at them or anything but these awesome alien things (quads) get their attention, and they do crowd around it. This is what i used to do, fly at afternoon around 1-3 most of the kids are at home. Then i had a dog "pluto" he used to scare every kid that came close to quad, and kids used to get scared by pluto a lot lolz. So i used to take him while i go for flying.

I have heard this a lot, from my wife and mom. Every time i crash they are like dare you touch that thing again.. :giggle:

Jokes apart a physical injury to anyone is not good. Good thing is it was nothing major, and you took care of it. With these things even in RCG you will hear a lot "FLY WITH CARE AND HUGE RESPONSIBILITY"

On the other hand let me not post the video.  Well there is nothing gory in the video though.  It is just crashing against the wall that's all, but the broken props are the ones that caused the mishap when it fell on the boy which is not on the video.  Anyway  while flying this thingy please make sure you fly slow so that it can be controlled and Never try to show off your flying skills.  Thats when all things go wrong.  I guess lots of lessons to be learnt personally. Sorry about this guys.

Happens to even best of us, we all learn from it. :thumbsup:

Hmm hope the boy is doing ok

Quick question - which mode is preferred for a beginner? + mode or x mode?

Actually + and x mode both are same. For Arial photography/FPV many prefer x more over +

Thanks Satya, will start with + mode and see how it goes.

I remember that was a good topic to argue upon on RCG in several threads. There are many various opinions regarding that. Ofcourse for AP/AV/FPV, 'X' mode is preferred, but I am using X-mode for normal flying also. I (and most others) fly outdoors and X-mode looks and flies great outdoors.

Vineet

Thanks, will give it a try

Today i tested my quad with KK2.0 on terrace at night. Test went smoothly, no damage. But default PI values are too high for non simonk flashed ESCs. It was 150 P on roll/pitch. As soon as throttle reached 50% it jumped in the air 4-5 feet which is i am sure not normal compare to my previous HK board, i landed it safely. Finally i have set mine at 40-50P roll/pitch and now performance is near to previous board. I will test again tomorrow as it's windy from past few days. I see lots of talk on RCG about advantages of using flashed escs. I am wondering but factory flashed simonk rapid escs are out.
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=780&productname=
I am sure hobbyking will be next.

Yes, the default P gain is way to high. I was wondering why my quad wants to commit suicide when it leaves the ground. I have also lowered it to the 40-50 range.
BTW which pack are you using - I am hardly getting ~3 mins from a 2200 mAH.

Sir me too using 2200mAh battery. It gave me same 3-4 min time on HK board. Later i flew with that battery more than 20-30 times allmost daily at night don't know exact time but it was good but now it has gave up after so many recharge and discharge cycles. Yesterday i flew quad with KK2.0 but i see lots of difference.

What prop and motor are you running Dharmik?

Sir i am using
MOTORS http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__5429__AX_2308N_1100kv_brushless_Micro_Motor.html
ESC http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=15202
And PROPS: 10x4.5
Here is video. HK V1 board
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EAT5wlfCuk

I think you have over propped your motor, i would not use anything more than 8x4 on it.
And please dont call me sir, i've not been knighted, yet :)

Yes sir so I have gemfan 8x4.5 props balanced and ready for new kk2. I bought them from rchobby addict last month.
Now I am flying in X mode. Here are some pics

Correction, I am getting close to 6:30 mins of flight time now from a 2200mAH pack.
Earlier, I hadn't setup the quad correctly. The nuts holding the props would become loose during the flight causing the motor to spin faster causing excess heat and current drain. Now, that i have loctited everything, its much better.

How does it flies sir with kk2.0? Please post video.

Hmm, it flies ok. I haven't been able to dial it in - will have to play around some more. Currently, I have set up at 30 P-gain and 5 I-gain. Rest settings are default. If I go more than 30 on the P-gain, then it starts to wobble (low frequency wobble).
Will try to take a video tomorrow.

Today i flashed one of damaged F-20A ESC with simonk firmware and it worked! So i will go further to flash my other ESCs soon. Here msg i got after flash. Fingers crossed
Flash the firmware from repository.

E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.exe -C E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.conf -p m8 -P usb -c usbasp -B 8 -e -U lfuse:r:E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\/lfuse.hex:r -U hfuse:r:E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\/hfuse.hex:r

avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.02s

avrdude.exe: Device signature = 0x1e9307
avrdude.exe: erasing chip
avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: reading lfuse memory:

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.00s

avrdude.exe: writing output file "E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\/lfuse.hex"
avrdude.exe: reading hfuse memory:

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.00s

avrdude.exe: writing output file "E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\/hfuse.hex"

avrdude.exe done.  Thank you.


E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.exe -C E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.conf -p m8 -P usb -c usbasp -B 8 -e -U lfuse:w:46:m -U hfuse:w:202:m

avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.02s

avrdude.exe: Device signature = 0x1e9307
avrdude.exe: erasing chip
avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: reading input file "46"
avrdude.exe: writing lfuse (1 bytes):

Writing | ################################################## | 100% 0.00s

avrdude.exe: 1 bytes of lfuse written
avrdude.exe: verifying lfuse memory against 46:
avrdude.exe: load data lfuse data from input file 46:
avrdude.exe: input file 46 contains 1 bytes
avrdude.exe: reading on-chip lfuse data:

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.02s

avrdude.exe: verifying ...
avrdude.exe: 1 bytes of lfuse verified
avrdude.exe: reading input file "202"
avrdude.exe: writing hfuse (1 bytes):

Writing | ################################################## | 100% 0.02s

avrdude.exe: 1 bytes of hfuse written
avrdude.exe: verifying hfuse memory against 202:
avrdude.exe: load data hfuse data from input file 202:
avrdude.exe: input file 202 contains 1 bytes
avrdude.exe: reading on-chip hfuse data:

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.00s

avrdude.exe: verifying ...
avrdude.exe: 1 bytes of hfuse verified

avrdude.exe done.  Thank you.

Flashing firmware from file.: E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex

E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.exe -C E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\lib\avrdude\windows\avrdude.conf -p m8 -P usb -c usbasp -B 8 -e -U flash:w:E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex:i

avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 0.02s

avrdude.exe: Device signature = 0x1e9307
avrdude.exe: erasing chip
avrdude.exe: set SCK frequency to 93750 Hz
avrdude.exe: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude.exe: reading input file "E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex"
avrdude.exe: writing flash (8192 bytes):

Writing | ################################################## | 100% 2.17s

avrdude.exe: 8192 bytes of flash written
avrdude.exe: verifying flash memory against E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex:
avrdude.exe: load data flash data from input file E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex:
avrdude.exe: input file E:\zzzzzzzzzzz\tmp\bs_nfet.hex contains 8192 bytes
avrdude.exe: reading on-chip flash data:

Reading | ################################################## | 100% 1.97s

avrdude.exe: verifying ...
avrdude.exe: 8192 bytes of flash verified

avrdude.exe done.  Thank you.
 

Good job!  :hatsoff:

Dharmik bro post some pictures of flashing of ESC please am planning to flash mine too...

Satya bro step by step tutorial up next. I flashed one damaged esc today. I flashed it again again 4-5 times, without bootloader and with bootloader enable and it went smoothly so i have decided to flash actual escs that i have on my quad right now. Flashed esc makes different voice while connecting with battery.

ya i have seen the video about the sound of the FLASHED ESC.. eagerly waiting for the tut...

Dharmik Bhai,  Is there a real real benefit from flashing to simon code?  How do you actually measure the benefit?  Is it much easier to control?  Just wanted to know.  I have just rebuilt my quad after that disaster 2 weeks ago.  Did a test flight in-house and all seems fine.  Just wanted to know if updating the Escs' really make a world of a difference or is it just a 10% increase in performance.

@dreamfly
Sir nice to hear from you that your quad is repaired. At this moment i can't say actual benefit and difference because test flight is yet to be done but Ashta sir has flashed ESCs and posted video of his quad. Today i flashed 5 ESCs and all went smoothly, tested them on bench with 1700kV motors it works fine. I will now test them on quad soon.

Is there anyone in india who's used I2C ESCs? The ESCs we use have a low refresh rate (400Hz?), and HK's SS series are worse, but I2C ESCs have a refresh rate of upto a KHz. Someone using an MK must be familiar.

Vineet

Vineet i heard about wii esc firmware. I also heard about i2c modification on rcg topic. I don't think anyone selling such escs. Simonk firmware also has high refresh rate.

Dharmik Bhai,  what are the tools used to flash the esc.  I am aware that we cannot flash the Turnigy plush using silab chip. 

Sir i am using USBASP cable and homemade connector. I am going to attach some pics i took recently.

Thanks Dharmik Bhai,  Just 2 more question:
1. is this Esc flashable?
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__15205__Hobby_King_30A_ESC_3A_UBEC.html

2. If it's not too much of a hastle,would you be able to help me flash my esc's if I purchased them and sent them to you.  I don't think I would have the patience to go thru all this.  I dont mind paying for your services.
or the other option is for you to help me build one of these gadgets you have built to flash the Esc's

Here I am waiting for (more) videos that compare sans-simonK f/w and reflashed with simonK f/w ESCs. I just am not understanding what big practical difference can be caused.
Thanks,
Vineet

Sure sir. In fact F-20A and F-30A are sisters. They both have programming pads at same place. Click on front and back "links" they both have same. Please have a look at this list
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AhR02IDNb7_MdEhfVjk3MkRHVzhKdjU1YzdBQkZZRlE#gid=0
Before you invest your money for those escs please wait for Astha sir's Review i will also post mine too because once ESC flashed we can't UNDO.
(http://0x.ca/~sim/esc/HK_F-30A/img_2231.jpg)
one more thing is there are no low voltage protection(requires additional alarm) and temp control in this simonk firmware.

Yeah bro, i was confused whether to flash my escs or not. I read somewhere that KK2.0 and more advanced boards need low gains to work with non-flashed escs and i found it true as i had to reduce my gain way below 40-50. Flashed escs can take high gains easily without wobble.
here is that post
 http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=22343475&postcount=1737

Dharmik bro, am again in problem today i tested my quad at home (with these rains i am not able to take it out to test) motor 2 and 4 stopped abruptly. Motor 2 continues to spin but motor 4 stops. :(

i could not test much as mom and wife started shouting :( but i am kind of curios why is this happening again??? any trouble shooting steps?

Satya bro what's your tx End Points settings?

End Points settings  :headscratch: :headscratch: i know you did told me about this earlier but i forgot can you tell me once again how to adjust to set that?? please :thanks: :thanks:

Hmm, I don't know what 'gain' means. Is it somewhat synonoymous to PID values (as in multiwii)?
Thanks, :)

vineet

OMG! THE ULTIMATE PROOF:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLKIOPbXVnM

Post: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1584629#9


I also posted in the f/w re-flashing thread.

Vineet

Yesterday i tested my quad with simonk flashed ESCs and i see huge improvement in stability. Now it doesn't oscillates even after increasing P gain to 80-100%. I have also changed props as admin SLS said and now using 8x4.5 gemfan props. props and flashed escs together makes quad more stable, better than previous HK board. I am still finding best gain settings, i will test further later and try to get it on video.

@Satya bro
I mean EPA settings in your tx configurations. Which tx you are using. Once i had such issue but after changing EPA to 120 and calibrating again it resolved.
@Vineet bro
Sorry yeah it's PID values.

Good to know  {:)}
BTW two question for you
1. You are using kk2.0 board right? Dont think the P gain values are in percent. They go higher than 100. Please correct if I am wrong.
2. Which mode you are running + or X

Thanks

So Dharmik Bhai, you seem to be very happy with your simon flashed esc

Bro this is my tx http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__16238__HobbyKing_HK6S_2_4Ghz_FHSS_6Ch_Tx_Rx_Mode_1_.html

@raja mastana
Yeah sir my mistake, they are not in percent. I am flying in X mode now.
@dreamfly
Yeah sir better than stock firmware. problem is i don't have open space where i can test my quad freely. Only rooftop left, I keep it as much low as i can near to the ground.
@Satya bro is that TX programmable?

No idea how do we know that???

Satya, looks like that radio is not programmable. Only servo reversing features is available.

Dharmik Bhai, Please post a closeup video if possible. 

So thats a bad news or good news?? :(

@dreamfly
Sir closeup video of quad or esc flashing?
@Satya bro try to calibrate individually and then together with kk2.0. They should work.
 If they don't try that trick. Connect all escs to the board and put throttle stick to the max. Power up the board by pressing and holding buttons 1 and 4. You will enter into programming board. First 4 beeps are for throttle range calibration. After 4th beep immediately bring the stick down. It should work for you. We both have same escs and it worked for me both time with non-flashed and flashed escs.

Closeup of flying. 

@Dharmik bro i will try that and let you know... I will flash my ESC as well, can you tell me from where did you got those wires/plugs from? (AVR to ESC)

@dreamfly
Sure sir. I will post video soon.
@Satya bro that's diy homemade USBASP to ESC wires and pin. It requires to connect 6 usbasp pins to the ESC.
MISO, MOSI, SCK, GND, VCC, RST
Actually flashing takes just 4-5 seconds but hard part is to select firmware, making that pin at home and proper contact to the pads while flashing(you can solder wire directly). After flashing 2 escs it started showing error for rest two escs. I had to scratch those pads on esc gently and then it went smoothly.

hmmm so soldering and flashing would be better idea?? what do you suggest??

Yeah bro soldering is reliable but you have to be very precise because there's only 1 or 2mm gap between pads. If you need i can send you my diy pin.

Are so generous of you bro, but i dont think without trying i should trouble you. Let me first try it out, and bro about soldering i have been doing that from a long time so i dont think it would be a problem for me but still i would take your advice and keep soldering as last option. While writing this i rem one thing, my very first order from HK instead of MALE TO MALE 10 CM connectors i bought MAKE TO FEMALE (servo extensions) now i can make good use of it :giggle:

Sure bro. Have you tested it with non-flashed esc?

Yes i have not yet flashed my esc, current situation that i explained to you is with the non flashed ESC. You recommend to flash my ESC??

Satya bro flashed escs would sure make difference but if your quad flies well you can continue with non flashed esc. I couldn't test my quad yesterday as i was out of town. If you really want to flash then you need to flash bs_nfet.hex for hk f-20a escs. 

here are pic of my crashed quad.  Have rebuilt it though.  Waiting for some props.  This Quad has drawn first blood! :(

@dharmik Have not been able to fly with the non flashed ESC was busy last week. Will try this week end, can you send me that hex file please..

@dreamfly are you using flashed ESC or non flashed ESC??

I fly with  the normal Turnigy Plush esc's  They are OK.  I have ordered some flashed esc's. Will have to check the WoW factor or those.

Satya Bhai,  which controller do you fly with?

HK Board 2.0 (the one with the LCD)

I read that plush ESCs are not suited for multirotors. It was well-discussed on many threads on RCG (esp. on the simonK's f/w flashing thread) that plush'es make a whine at 8Khz (or 16?), well, I don't know what it really means, but that's undesirable.
Many said the hobbyking F-20 or F-30 or F-40s (with light-blue heat shrink) flashed with SimonK outperform the Plush ESCs and even the Maytech ESCs of montorc.
F-20, F-30 and F-40 are WAY CHEAPER than the plush.
Anyone tried them?

Dharmik and me we both are using F-20

Dharmik have flashed but i haven't yet

Oh, wow. I thought you were using BlueSeries. :)

umm :headscratch:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__15202__Hobby_King_20A_ESC_3A_UBEC.html


this is one i am using, thats F-20 right?

Yeah Satya bro that's F-20A. Check product id on that page. And there's no surprise that both F-20A and F-30A are now on backorder.

Yup bro i know

The Turnigy esc's are for sure not built for multirotors because of their smoother throttle response more suitable for planes (multirotors are pretty new inventions).  So we'll have to wait and see how the Esc manufactureres respond to this new gen hobby and how?

Hello,

Greetings...

I am a newbie to this field... And I intend to make a Quad for which I have purchased the materials... Also I am ready with the assembly... The place where I am stuck is the Programming... I have HobbyKing Multi-Rotor Control Board V3.0 (Atmega328 PA) and Seriously I have no clue what to do with that....

Specs:
1.   HobbyKing Multi-Rotor Control Board V3.0 (Atmega328 PA)               x 1
2.   Turnigy D2830-11 1000kv Brushless Motor                                     x 4
3.   HobbyKing 30A BlueSeries Brushless Speed Controller                       x 4
4.   Hk X550 Frame                                                                         x 1
5.   Fly Sky 6 Channel Tx n Rx

Thankyou...

Hey Adiboy,

You will need a programmer to program hk board, something like this
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21321__USBasp_AVR_Programming_Device_for_ATMEL_proccessors.html

Here is a video about programming the same
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgdMEqWRGWY

ESC manufacturers have responded to the multirotor mania pretty well. Castle creations has released a series of multirotor firmware flashed ESCs.(f/w diff. from simonK's) Rctimer has some 10 SimonK flashed ESCs. MontoRC advertises Maytech ESCs suited for multicopters, But then, HK hasn't done anything yet, which makes a lot of difference.

Something off topic, Vineet i noticed your signature now


Very nice :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Haha, that signature is quite true, for every noob. :giggle:

I think I recognize that signature. 

yeah, i copied it from somewhere i don't remember...

Very true


:rofl: :rofl:

Dear Satyagupta Sir,

Really this video link of your's broke the ice... I searched many related things after watching your video link...
Finally I feel like it can be flown within 4-5 days...

Thanks a lot...

As I said I am newbie I dont know how to operate radio and that I have heard needs practice.... Earlier I have made an Airboat with RC stuff but used a surface pistol radio which was no big deal....

M also planning to work on PID control and programming the Quad myself but I am sure it will take some time...

Adiboy you can call me 'Satya' Gupta is my last name and 'Sir' is too much for me :)

Yeah will keep in mind....
BTW I am Aditya...

great :) so its Aditya :) do post your build logs and post queries if any there are many members in RCI who will definitely help you out.

Can anyone please tell me the difference between X copter and plus copter configuration...?

Aditya,  If you are learning how to fly a quad for the first time. Go the + way. It's easy for orientation.  It would feel like a Airplace with a Nose, wings and a tail.  If you start with an X there isn't anything for direction and you might get lost trying to fly.  I started off with the +.  Worked for me.  Others might have a different openion.  But if you are looking at the actual flight differences, I think there are non.

I fly X now.  May be I need to try out the + on my quad just for comparison's sake.

Thanks for ur wonderful opinion... I will keep that in mind and my first config will be +....

The real problem I face is that I haven't used the Radio control ever in my life... So dunno anything about it other than theory...
What Should I do to atleast learn basics of Operation of my Radio....  Btw I own Fly-Sky 6 Channel radio...

Thankyou again...

Therefore one has to start somewhere.  You can and should expect the following:
1. A hole in your Wallet (depends on ....... )
2. Sleepless nights
3. Shouts and screams
4. Cuts and broken props
5. A feeling of giving up (But dont)
6. A feeling of Continuation (But cant)
7. ......
8. .......

Your frighten me..... :headscratch: I am now  :-\

What should be my first step...?

Aditya bro first try to learn flying on FMS simulator. There are some multirotor models available for FMS that you can try and test your skill. Disable channel 5 and 6 for first start.

Dear Dharmik bhai,

I searched about simulator options in my Radio... Fly Sky 6 Channel purchased from aeroworks...

http://www.aeroworks.co.in/radio_8505.html (http://www.aeroworks.co.in/radio_8505.html)

There is some different cable which connects to this radio and then I can have simulation on my same radio..

Can u find n tell me that cable...?

Hey I didnt mean to scare you.  Really just trying to check your pulse.  If you really love aero modelling and have  aero related virus is in your blood.... then not even the devil can stop you.  So first of all you need to have passion and that my friend.... no one can give you.  But then, you can also buy a ready made model if you think building is not your cup of tea.  But believe me you learn a lot by doing.... Just go for it.

Hey Dreamfly....

I wasn't scared my friend... I was just being sarcastic  ;) ... Making an Airboat was my first venture in RC hobby and I struggled for it 6 months and then finally got it right (not exactly but got a considerable round of applause)... So passion is not at all the issue... Going through the probable right path and learning from experiences of others is my priority here....

Btw Thanks for the heads up...!

Will go on your advice...

Please could u brief me about the hardware arrangement of 'X' copter & '+' copter configuration...

Thankyou...!

Everything is same aditya, just the motor layout changes. In my view + or x both mode are same. X modes are preferred for aerial photography or FPV. As the view is clear in the x mode.

My first build was + now i am doing X mode.. :thumbsup:

I think you need to also orient the FCB depending on the mode x or +
i.e.
if +, then it has to be placed such that it points to the front prop,
if x, then it has to be placed such that it point between two props.

Is this correct assumption?

Yup it is raja :)

Thanks buddy

Thanks Satya & Raja....!

Will do the changes and inform you accordingly.... Will post few pics today or tommorow for you guys to get better idea...

Does anybody have idea about the flight simulation cable for Fly Sky 6 Channel Radio...?

Thankyou again...!

Agree
@Adiboy
Those cables are different. The one comes with sales package is programming cable. You will have to buy simulator cable.
@dreamfly
Sir do you have auto-level feature on open-pilot?

Thanks Dharmik Bro...

Can u guide me which simulator cable will fit my radio because searched a lot and I am not getting any firm thing...

Again My radio is Fly Sky 6 Channel purchased from Aero Engineering Works...

Thankyou...

All FC boards these days have autolevelling (Acclerometers take care of those).  If there are any boards without Accelerometers then  those boards cannot autolevel when you let go of the controls- also called "hands free" flying but will surely drift if there is breeze.  So yes in that context the openpilot has autoleveling. I only fly in that mode  - easy to fly.

Okie actually in KK2.0 we only have control over yaw and throttle(no roll/pitch) when auto-level activated. btw have they launched new board CC3D?

is the KK v2.0 the newest?  If so then I saw a video the other day somewhere where they use it to balance a hobby toy motorcycle on a small rod and it balances perfectly.  So I don't believe that it has control only over  yaw.  
I'll try and find that video and post it.

CC3D still hasn't been officially launched.  The testers are still testing it and bugs are being ironed out.  I just sold one of my CC' boards.  Waiting for the release of the CC3D so I can buy one to try.

Ah
Here is that video:
https://www.youtube....player_embedded

sorry check the link below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8RN8wMnQpg&feature=player_embedded

@dreamfly
thanks for your reply sir
@Adiboy
Here is the pic of both cables. At the top programming cable, bottom simulator cable and converter pin. I can't get my programming cable work with simulator.

@ dreamfly
Wow... What a video sir...

@ Dharmik
Thanks bro for the pics.... Where can I get the sim cable like u have one..? I s it available on HK..? I have an order prepared to pay... Please tell me so that I can add the same...

Thankyou...

@ Dharmik

Here is the link of a forum in which please refer to the 10th post by MEITZI....He says we can run that radio without a simulator cable i.e. by the regular USB Cable.... (Please go through it and tell me ur views..)

http://clearviewrc.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1196 (http://clearviewrc.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1196)

Thanks...

Yes that video is really amazing. Thank you sir.
@Adiboy
Bro i will search and let you know.

Awesome video
thanks for sharing!

@Adiboy
Bro here is the link of that cable.
http://thehobbyshop.in/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=22&zenid=b6rget56kg1dpvvo60pm0u04t7

@ Dharmik

Thanks a lot bro.... I searched the similar thing in HK and also placed the order....

+1
Thanks again...!

Bought a new programmable FlySky 9X tx and rx http://www.aeroworks.co.in/radio_8506.html

it offers you 3 modes HELI, PLANE or GLIDERS what do i select for quads???

Airplane

Hmmmm you sure>???

Yep, it is mentioned in the kk2 manual

ohhhh never read that manual lolz

thanks bro :thumbsup:

no problem :)

A kind of very noob question but i want to know about radio's 4 channels and its relation with quads movement.

This is what i know:
Channel 2/Elevator used for forward/backward direction
Channel 3/Throttle used to control the speed of the motors

Now Aileron & Rudder, why does this channel is used for?? left/right movement or yaw rotation???

This is what i knew or i thought was right, (with mode 1 radio) the left/right stick (aileron) on the throttle side or the RHS of the radio is used for YAW rotation of the quad and other left/right stick (rudder) is used for left/right movement of the quad..

Am i right??? :headscratch: :headscratch: do i make some sense??

Aileron channel: for ROLL (sideward 'drift')
elevator channel: for PITCH (for forward/backward 'drift')
Throttle: controlling the speed of the motors and thus the climb-rate of the multirotor
Yaw channel: for yaw, ie. for the rotation of the quad about it's own axis.

AFAIK, mode 1 radios have Throttle and yaw on the right, and roll and pitch on the left.

Hmm no dude, mode 1 has throttle and aileron on right

This is the mode 1 hk radio https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__16238__HobbyKing_HK6S_2_4Ghz_FHSS_6Ch_Tx_Rx_Mode_1_.html
And this is its manual
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uploads/555358187X77565X57.pdf
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uploads/116857157X518604X55.jpg

But what you said solved my doubt/query thanks :thumbsup:

Oh, sorry then. But why did you prefer Mode1? (But I guess you're selling your mode1 radio now). Did you buy a mode 2 this time? And how's your 9X?? ;D

I am used to mode 1 :D but this programmable radios are so great stuffs that you can change anything.. Stick positions or even MODE, awesome isnt it?? it is :D

My new 9X is great just awesome, you wont believe but now i can fly my quad very nicely. Atleast i can lift it up the ground with out any glitch :giggle: actually the great control that you have on your radio and its configuration that matters a lot.. Its exactly same as the one you are trying to get from BIMALVED exactly same just name is different FlySky

I see we can easily convert mode1 into mode2. There's spring inside that you need to fix on other side.

Yes, we can convert, but I sorta spoilt my radio doing that.
I was trying to remove the remotely-located spring and broke a small mech. plastic part. Now the yaw stick has no spring and moves freely.
Then I tried to attach the plastic part back (using fevikwik) and tried various springs, but it would be either too strong or too loose, never the same way it was.
So now I disabled yaw on my radio and fly it. :(

http://www.rcindia.org/rc-general-topics/mode-1-or-mode-2-pinch-or-thumb/

btw, I think using mode2 is a little more convenient, since pitch and roll are what require more precision than throttle/yaw. So having roll and pitch on te right hand is better, anyway there are MANY opinions on this...

:thumbsup:


Yes, exactly the same, but one small differnce. AFAIK, flysky TH-9X has it's antenna ATTACHED to it's module itself, right?
But turnigy 9x has it's antenna and module separately.
I will never be upgrading my module from turnigy to any FRSKY or something and I don't need telemetry, so i preferred turnigy 9x... :)
Vineet

Ya bro it has antenna attached to its module but does that matters?? i have really no idea what these modules are and how helpful they are..

And yes after knowing that sidewards drift is with throttle even i think mode2 is a little more convenient. Do you know any video where i can find how to convert mode 1 to mode 2???

No, it doesn't matter as long as you don't seriously think of upgrading the module to FrSky or something else.
As someone had answered to your post, module is that part of the transmitter which has all the radio components in it.
Most people (on RCG) buy a turnigy 9x WITHOUT module and buy an FrSky module with telemetry.

You can follow this video to convert mode 1 to mode2 (found in a random search) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmmG9QRKQzI&feature=related

Cool thanks bro :)

just before you posted this, I saw the video myself and noted how dumb it was, sorry for that. I changed the link. :)

its cool man thanks again :thumbsup:

:thumbsup: Any plans to upgrade your 9X's firmware? To TH9X or ER9X? I think you should now be reading http://9xforums.com

Hmmm some alien words for me there.. Now the manual that came along with the radio says this FS-TH9X so does that means that i have TH9X module in it??

BTW this is one that i am using Fly Sky 9 channel 2.4 GHz Transmitter and Receiver
http://www.aeroworks.co.in/radio_8506.html

Thanks for the link btw that would help me to know more about the modules and stuff, btw is it important to upgrade it?

No, it's not very important to upgrade. A firmware upgrade just means better menus and more options (which can be more confusing)... Maybe it's better to first get used to the simpler stock firmware and then upgrade to er9x.

hi pls suggest me a frame size to make a quad cop.i will use 750mah motor.

750mah motor!?!?

@rajibcic

Bro its 700 Kv.... which implies rpm/volt.. i.e. at every volt u get 700 rpm rise in the motor...

whereas here "mah" is an abbreviation for battery rating which implies Milli Ampere hour...

ya it should be 750kv.u may say printing mistake. ;D.by the by can u say the optimum size of quad frame

Bro there's no thumb rule about the size of frame. Generally for 750kV motor you will use 10-12inch props, so make sure they don't fight with each-other.
Try 525mm to 600mm

SimonK Firmware Flashing Tutorial
As promised here is complete tutorial.
http://rcsci.blogspot.in/2012/08/tutorial-simonk-esc-firmware-flashing.html
One more tutorial can be found here by Ashta sir
http://www.rcindia.org/servos-gyros-and-all-electronics/esc-do-it-yourseld-firmware-flashing

If any correction please let me know. Also if anybody wants to flash ESC i can do it for you without any charge. You just have to pay shipping. At this moment i will able to flash only HK F series ESCs only as pin designed for it.

Nice blog indeed! :)

Thank you Satya and Vineet bros. Btw Vineet bro are you using this board?
http://www.rcelectro.com/index.php/quadcopter-and-parts/multiwii-mwc-se-flight-control-board-v1-0-detail

Nice to see multiwii boards in india. I was using the 'lite' version of it (without baro and mag).
I am now switching to AfroFlight Naze32. ;D

guys today i converted my flysky 9X from MODE-1 to MODE-2 it was easy

BTW here is a very good tutorial provided by Aero Works Team :thumbsup:
http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Turnigy-9X-Mode-1-to-Mode-2-conversion/5832/1

really nice quad...
but from where did you get motors, esc and props???

use the sites search function,

http://www.rcelectro.com
http://www.rcdhamaka.com
http://aeroworks.co.in/

and non Indian

http://www.hobbyking.com

Hey guys i have a query,

Battery: 3S 4000 mah 20C
ESC: 4 x HK blue series 20A
Motor: DT750
Props: 1047
FC: KK2 LCD board
and 4 x LCD led strip

All i want to know is my battery came along with a bullet connector, now i want to use XT60 connectors in place of that. But this connector will be good upto 60A current, so will this setup be good with XT60 connectors??

Can We make Our OWN Cntrolling Board ?

Can you help me for it ?

If i wanna USE ATMEL MEGA Controller. then How can I make it /
What factors I have to take care for it ?

For to make Controlling board for my quadcopter How can i Start for it ?
Approx. Weight -
Dimension = 15'' * 15'' [If possible then will reduce it to 12''*12'']
Battery - 175 gm
base - 325 gm If another mAterial Will use.]
Battery - 75 *4 = 300 gm [Will USE 2200kv Motor So It will aroung 2000 rpm Approx.]
ECS = 15 * 4 = 60 gm [40A Will be suitable for 2200kv Motor Each]
connectors = 50 gm
Controlling Board = 200 gm
Other Peripherels = 200 gm
________________________________________________
Approx Total Weight [[MAX.] = 1310 gm ==>Max. Weight.

@Satya bro IMO it will be fine. You have to consider amp draw by motor.

@Swapnil bro this is a tough work. Programming, debugging and testing would take so much time to make safe firmware. If you are completely new to multirotor, it's not good idea. Check rcgroups forum, it might help you.

Its will be around 13-15 AMPS (per motor) as per reviews adn the datasheet i have read..

Have anybody seen this? Now it's driving me crazy
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__26588__MultiWii_PRO_Flight_Controller_w_MTK_GPS_Module.html

no man thanks for the link but i think its expensive...

Satya bro that's great deal you are getting GPS with it. More to say it's WKM at just 65 bucks. This will be sure in my wishlist but let's how review comes.

Newbie question, why would I want to upgrade to MultiWii from HK board ???

ummmm hmmmm even i would like to know. :headscratch: all that i know is with multiwii you can have great control over your quad not sure though

Ok now i am a bit confused :headscratch: just checkd HK FC category under multirotor and i see these 4 boards

MultiWii 328P Flight Controller w/FTDI & DSM2 Port --> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27033__MultiWii_328P_Flight_Controller_w_FTDI_DSM2_Port.html
MultiWii Lite V1.0 Flight Controller w/FTDI --> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27109__MultiWii_Lite_V1_0_Flight_Controller_w_FTDI.html
MultiWii SE V2.0 Flight Controller w/FTDI --> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27108__MultiWii_SE_V2_0_Flight_Controller_w_FTDI.html
MultiWii PRO Flight Controller w/MTK GPS Module --> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__26588__MultiWii_PRO_Flight_Controller_w_MTK_GPS_Module.html

can any one shed some light on it:
what is the difference between all of them??? all are mutliwii so more or less they are similar, so y 4 :banghead: am kind of noob with this mutliwii and stuff :headscratch:

HK has atlast realised what people want.
That FC is fine, but if you add ~$7 you'll get a CRIUS MultiWii AIO Pro (from goodluckbuy.com or rctimer.com). It has better sensors (MPU6050) as against the obselete ITG3205 and BMA180. ITG3205 has a low precision and is crappy, ITG3200 would have been better.
AND, Crius AIO pro supports dual firmware (MegaPirates) which enables GPS waypoints with the help of a mission planner! All these just at an extra cost of $7!!! (GPS module extra)

CRIUS AIO pro: http://www.goodluckbuy.com/crius-all-in-one-pro-flight-controller-v1-0-support-megapirateng-and-multiwii-.html (http://www.goodluckbuy.com/crius-all-in-one-pro-flight-controller-v1-0-support-megapirateng-and-multiwii-.html)

Vineet

*programmability* MultiWii also has a GREAT GUI, which no HK board has. Add a bluetooth module and you can configure your multiwii using your android phone (that's not a piece of luxury, it comes into use at the field)
No more gyro pots, etc.

@satya:

Link 1: crappy gyros + Acc + baro + mag. Includes programmer. Not so good.
Link 2: A good gyro+Acc unit (MPU6050). No baro and mag = no altitude hold, orientations, etc. includes programmer
Link 3: Link 2 + baro + mag. includes programmer
Link 4: Ref. reply #284.
:)

Thanks Vineet helped a lot :thumbsup:

Update: refer all posts on the first page of http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1726790 .
Most opine CRIUS AIO pro is a safer bet.

@satya: you're welcome.

Can We make Our OWN Cntrolling Board ?

Can you help me for it ?

If i wanna USE ATMEL MEGA Controller. then How can I make it /
What factors I have to take care for it ?

For to make Controlling board for my quadcopter How can i Start for it ?
Approx. Weight -
Dimension = 15'' * 15'' [If possible then will reduce it to 12''*12'']
Battery - 175 gm
base - 325 gm If another mAterial Will use.]
Battery - 75 *4 = 300 gm [Will USE 2200kv Motor So It will aroung 2000 rpm Approx.]
ECS = 15 * 4 = 60 gm [40A Will be suitable for 2200kv Motor Each]
connectors = 50 gm
Controlling Board = 200 gm
Other Peripherels = 200 gm
________________________________________________
Approx Total Weight [[MAX.] = 1310 gm ==>Max. Weight.

Now when you have decided to make your own controller. Please check here
, to be honest i don't have knowledge to that level.
http://www.newbiehack.com/MicrocontrollerWritingthefirstprogramandtransfer.aspx
http://www.societyofrobots.com/microcontroller_tutorial.shtml
Please search over google, you will find many tutorials there. May be experts can give you direction to go further into this. You need deep knowledge of electronics and programming. Collecting data from receiver and sensors and process them sending them to ESCs etc looks simple but in practical it's one of the challenging task and problem is it's college project, you will have to complete within given timeline.

Need Some  more Reference who can help me in gujarat. Most probably in ahmedabad and rajkot. If possible then give more data and links here.. Can i use 8051 Controller? How ?

Multirotor fever can be seen now. HK has launched new multistar esc and completely new ready to use wiring harness for quad and hexa.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1744742

..............and apparently the 'gurus' sitting there declared it useless...!
But I seriously appreciate hobbyking's demand-driven business, truly! :)

Really helpful post for new entrants like me :)

Can anyone help me how to configure the pit of roll, pitch and yaw in kk5.5 black board with a nice pic previously adjusted...??

The above content is for Quadcopter plus(+) configuration....

Hi for stock firmware generally 35-50% gain would be enough.

If someone has missed then here is the new firmware v1.3 for KK2.0
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23163622&postcount=5994

can u people tell me from where to get all the stuffs necessary for building a basic quad roter,its my 7th sem project...i would be happy if u gys guide me

quadkopters.com (http://quadkopters.com) :giggle:

@Satyagupta,  I am interested in the simulator. Does it have a quad in it?  I am also looking at connecting it to my Futaba radio.  Does it come with appropriate cables?
You can send it mail on lobo.roland@gmail.com.

Rgds
Roland

Yes it comes with all cables and it comes with some simulators, i guess Pheonix RC comes with quad in it. And some other simulator as well. You can buy it online http://www.quadkopters.com/product/12-in-1-new-simulator/ simple registration and simple checkout process.

Has anybody used the DT700s? I just got 4 along with 12x4.5 SF props. Wondering if someone who has used them can share his experience..

I am using them for my quad, but its DT750 and its good, i am using it with 11.47 props good thrust...

The 750s are pretty well documented, but I could not find any ratings for the 700s using 12x4.5 hk props... Will post here when I get them :P

hello, dharmik sir, dreamfly sir

your information about Multi-rotor helped me a lot in selecting components.. :salute: :thumbsup:

I want to ask you few more questions..
I am little bit confused between control boards..
one
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=25094
and
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19534__HobbyKing_Multi_Rotor_Control_Board_V2_1_Atmega168PA_.html
for which should I go??

also I am very new to Multi-rotors can you please tell me assembly steps and also prerequisites befor 1st fly?

I have selected following components..
750Kv out runner 800gm thrust Imax= 14A
propellers 10*4.5(2 RH/ 2 RR)
hobbyking 20A ESC
2300mAh 3s 30c Lipo battery

please I need your support
 :help: :help: :help:

I think you should go with KK2.0
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24723__Hobbyking_KK2_0_Multi_rotor_LCD_Flight_Control_Board.html

If you are into DIY or Arduino, nothing beats this multiwii: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27033__MultiWii_328P_Flight_Controller_w_FTDI_DSM2_Port.html (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__27033__MultiWii_328P_Flight_Controller_w_FTDI_DSM2_Port.html)
If you want out of the box performance and easy setup you can go for the kk2 board. Although this lacks some sensors and is not expandable like the multiwii, it is a very good beginners board! But bear in mind, get the usbasp programmer. The new version of the kk2 firmware is a must upgrade for this board.

Don't cut costs with the flightcontroller. Make your own frame and save costs but a cheap fc will result in more damage to your quad=more costs. And buy tons of props ;D

+1 Lastrites

Hello from Poland :)

1st of all I'd like to thank mr.Dharmik for making a great tutorial on how to make your own multirotor UAV - great job!!!!!

I took the liberty and made some editing to the tutorial, added some new stuff and it all ended up as a nice guide in a .doc :D - Hope You don't mind :).
It would be cool if everyone could contribute and make the best tutorial ever :)

Here's the link:
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_43sXBfFG_ZZVpNVzY3eEZHelk/edit?usp=sharing

Ehhhh, Gdocs messed it up a bit :p

Ohhh, and sorry for the part with the polish description - I'll make an  update soon:)

If you have missed it, here is the new firmware v1.6 from KK. I flashed and flew my quad on last weekend and it flies great.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=25062618&postcount=13868

Thanks!

Sir i am beginner for this quadrotor or miltirotor copter project, so sir can u help me with this. I just want to know what parts are needed for making a quadcopter and where i can find them , cause I am a polytechnic student and want to make it for my major project for my third year . So please sir help me with this project.

You can find the parts from many LHS, Please search the forums about it.

i need help in my quadrotor. using kk3.0 board. the quad is toppeling one side as soon as it lifts. some1 plz help me..

Dear Dharmik

I am a new guy in the forum... I was most impressed with your multirotor tutorial  {:)}...after reading the Part one where are the other parts of the tutorial? If you please let me know I will be grateful  :hatsoff:

hope to hear from you asap

regards

Joy

Hi Joy
Thank you for your encouraging words. I have composed 2nd part to the half way. I will complete the rest part and post it soon.

Sure Dharmik

Though it has been quite a wait between the the part 1 and the part 2  :help: but definitely I hope its worth the waiting.

You are In Gujarat I am in delhi I hope we can meet sometime

regards  :hatsoff:

Joy

Hi Guys,

what i read and saw is very inspirational. I am amazed that you guys can build such fantastic units on your own.  My dreams of becoming a pilot were shattered when i developed weak eyesight early in school. This sounds like a fun way to get into the game..

Can anyone please tell me how much does making this cost? i am really interested in knowing and learning this art.

Thank you all and all the best!!!

can we use high KV motors for High speed flying in QUAD

high kv motors with small diameter or lower kv with bigger props

so if your motor has 1200KV or more then 8 inch prop or less

If your motor has 1100kv or less then 9 inch prop or bigger.

I follow this funda:

Lower KV: (900 - 700) and bigger props (10-11) with higher pitch (3-5)

hello ppl .. i'm building my quad with following specs.
1)turnigy D2836 1100kv (with compression type prop adapters) {hobbyking}
2)25A Q brain ESC {hobbyking}
3)KK2.1 {hobbyking}
4)avionic rb6i 6ch rx and tx {rcbazaar}
5)1147 props / 1245 props (trying both) {hobbyking}
6)Aluminum frame either Hiller x550 {rcbazaar} or homemade
   if homemade, specs > shaft to shaft 700mm approx
7)battery 3s rhino 4900mah 20c {Hobbyking}
              4s wolfpack 2800mah 
below is the image of Ecalc dot ch data sheet .. please tell me if the flight time im getting is good or bad , below image is with respect to 3s lipo                    
   

Whats AUW of your quad?

satya sir i  working on the VTOL dual copter project     but i cant find the firmware for the same i m useing KKV2.1

Search for and download 'kkmulticopterflashtool'. It has all kinds of firmwares including that for dual copter. I successfully flashed the monocopter firmware on my kk1 board.

thanks satya sir

what are the different types of flight control board for building quadcopter with GPS
available?
starting from the least budget to the highest...

which is the good budget control board with GPS you suggest.
thanking you for your time.
john

with gps the cheapest is multiwii

Thanks nitesh
 you havent specified which muilti wii board there are many some come in combos
do they open source and help on this forum??
incase of trouble?
john

i have a doubt regarding battery , i have 16000mah with 15C. 6s,22.2v,
and i am using this for an octa coptor , the max amph of motor is 40A,
as u said for 16000 mah with 15C= 16x15 =240, where has we require 40x8= 320
my question is will it be a problem if so what is the problem ,will the battery get more heat ,or motors will not perform full efficiency, pls ans wer my question

which motor which frame which battery which esc are you using ?

When battery drains beyond its limit, there is chance to damage it permanently. It might also affect flight characteristics as motors wont get enough power to compensate gains. Generally people use hexas and octas for heavy lift payload and considering this fact you need atleast 16k 20C battery to meet your setup requirements.

sir,i just build my quadcopter and i have done 4-5 test flights.But durning last test flight my quadcopter crashed and one cell of my "3S 5000mAh 35C" lipo battery was completely dead.Would you please guide me to compensate my voltage loss.It will be very helpful if you can guide me to choose battery to connect it to my damaged one.

Now you can remove the damaged cell and use the pack as 5000mAh 2S.

Which make and batch is your battery pack ?
If you plan to add a similar 5000mAh cell to make  3S pack again, you have to get a cell of same characteristics, may be from another pack of same capacity, same brand and model.
Getting 5000mAh single cell is hard you may get 2S pack and take one cell from it though :)

For those who have not noticed new firmware of RC911 released. please find below rc911 v1.6 rev4 for KK2 only


Revision 4:
-----------

* Channel mapping with support for AUX2, AUX3 and AUX4 features.
* Flight timer (displayed on the SAFE screen) runs while armed and throttle is above idle.
* A setup menu is displayed after a factory reset and whenever user profile #1 is reset. This menu is also accessible from the KK2 main menu (select "Initial Setup").
* New motor layout: V-Tail Hunter.
* LVA beep length is now limited to 1/4 second.
* RX signal handling improved. For slow booting receivers status texts like "No aileron input" will be displayed until valid RX signals are detected.
* The LVA setting is now checked upon arming from the Quick Tuning screen. This makes the KK2 LED flash if the LVA value is set too low.
* Added a second Receiver Test screen for displaying AUX2, AUX3 and AUX4 input values.
* On the Receiver Test screen, the throttle text now says "Idle" when the throttle actually IS idle. This makes the lower throttle endpoint adjustment easier.
* On the Receiver Test screen the aileron, elevator, rudder, aux2 and aux3 texts now say "Center" when these channels are centered precisely.
* The status text on the SAFE screen will now be highlighted (and flashing) when attention is needed. This also applies to the Quick Tuning screen.
* New status message: "Check throttle level" will be displayed when the throttle stick is above idle position (preventing arming).
* New status message: "RX signal was lost" will be displayed on the SAFE screen if an RX output failure occurred during flight. This will also trigger the Lost Model Alarm.
* Added a second screen to Gimbal Settings. The gimbal home position parameters are set from this new screen and they can be utilized by mapping the KK2 AUX input to AUX4.
* ESC calibration now has more on-screen (usage) information.
* When roll and pitch are linked only one set of PI parameters are displayed for "Ail+Ele".
* SL Mixed mode is now activated when the (Lost Model) Alarm function is selected. Acro mode was used earlier.
* Alarm status is now shown on the SAFE screen.
* Sanity error screen improved/optimized.
* The beep that was produced every time the AUX switch changed position will now be skipped if the flight mode stays unchanged.
* Removed code for "hidden" button (PREV) on the Show Motor Layout screen.
* Miscellaneous GUI changes and code optimizations.
* Bug fixed: Button(s) held down during start-up will no longer trigger the menu or change user profile.
* Bug fixed: Setting the Minimum Throttle value to 20 (maximum) will no longer produce a "One or more settings are out of limits" warning.
* Bug fixed: AUX switch settings appeared to be unaffected by a profile reset (when visiting the AUX Switch Setup screen before the SAFE screen).
* Bug fixed: The User Profile screen had a problem with selection highlighting after importing profile data.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2340156

Hello all!
I am new on this forum and a newbie in RC stuff.
Just built a quadcopter from scratch but it seems to have a lot of problems, not flying properly, cant even level, motors not working with same speed.
My setup is:
1. 2.4G FlySky FS-CT6B 6-Channel Transmitter + Receiver (R6B)
2. KK2.1 Multi-rotor LCD Flight Control Board With 6050MPU and Atmel 644PA
3. 1400KV/1800KV Brushless Motor + 30A ESC Speed Controller + 1045R Counter Rotating Propeller Set
4. F450-V2 4-Axis Multicopter Frame with PCB Board
5. QK LIPO 2200mah 11.1V 20C/40C
6. B3AC charger
7. SF Propeller 10*4.5 SF/10*4.5

These are the things I bought and assembled. All went well, until I tried to fly it.
1. It is not balancing
2. Not even flying properly
3. Flew and hit me instead (cuts and wounds included)
4. Hit the wall
5. When I checked without the propellers I found that all the motors are not even rotating properly with same exact speed.
6. Sometimes the throttle is 30% but 2 & 4 motors are working but 1 & 3 are not rotating with proper speed, as I open the throttle more to around 60% motor no.1 gains full speed but 3 is still idle. Only when I hit the throttle full motor no.3 starts and also with less speed and after 30 secs it stops working although the others are working with full speed. I pull throttle down and again do it, the same thing happens but the motors slow down after a minute and the 3rd motor finally stops at full throttle.
I can't figure out what the problem is, if any of you experts could help me I will be highly obliged.
Thank you. :)

sourajit some pics or video might help but as you mentioned above it seems your ESC are not clibrated properly. they must start in sync all together so check kk2.1 manual for calibrating ESCs. once you do this check if this problem still persists or not. wear goggles and keep distance.

GIVEN INFORMATION IS GOOD BUT WHERE I CAN BUY THESE ITEMS CHEAP AND BEST ESPECIALLY TRANSISTER, IT THE COSTLIEST ITAM IN MAKING RC AND THEN BATTERY.

I bought from two websites.
Hactroniks.com
Quadkopters.com
Both provide these items quite cheap only.
And Dharmik man, I will post a video and pictures of my problems later today.

@khalsa
Hi....Regarding the usage of battery. If it is a lipo normally manufacturer gives with 3.5V for each cell. However if you will charge  it will go upto 4.2V. So the usage period of each cell is from 4.2V to 3.5V. So 3.5V is the safe voltage where you can regain to your battery utility. If any cell drop beyond 3.5V make sure you will charge immediately if it is  beyond 3.0V then your battery is in critical situation. This happens because of the reason If Your system is pulling more current than the supply. For example in your case 5000 mah 3s 35c, so max current provided by battery is 5x35=175A. If your system is pulling more than this then there is a chance of swelling of your battery and slowly damage after 3-4 flights. Although you can regain the same battery to life if you are putting the battery in balance charging mode(which is always recommended & always charge with 1c discharge rate) for long time after flight. Make sure you must attach one battery beeper with Battery during flight which will help you during flight. If the beeper starts beeping then make sure you have to land your vehicle which in turn protects your battery from damaging.
Thanks 

Nice effort Bro ... Really helpful . I appreciate your effort n hours spend for this .

Thanks for sharing such a useful information here. Ofcourse it will be helpful for my future projects.
I have some questions that what MCU board should be used to develop the multirotor?
Also what type of motors should be used and what should be their I-V specifications?

If ur motors are running at different speeds then it is an indication that ur esc are not calibrated.do it and ur problem will be resolved for sure.u can check the procedure for the same on YouTube.

Heat Shrink Tubing

Here is the full video of heat shrink tubing 40mm done on the aluminium square tube. Special thanks to Manish for providing tubes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLWJ9fONWb8

Final frame. 16x16 aluminium tube with heat shrinking. and custom designed xtreme v2 frame. will post full topic later

Same GF cutting from my old CNC machine?

Hi
Anyone help me my first time I am going to bullit my zmr250 quad but some doubt

Zmr250 frame
Dys1806 2300 mottor
Afro 12a opto ESC
Naze32 rav5
Marek pdb v5 low woltag alarm
Frsky d4r2 receiver
Turnigy 9xr pro
Frsky djt module
1300mah nano tech lipo
Anyone help me how can connect receiver to naze32 and ESC also

Naze 32 rav5 Bord  it s not work to directly.. It s only use after firmware flash ...?

Yup satya bro. trying to complete old project again.

Motors mounted with rubber grip.

Added align heli landing skid, but weight is high.

Hey guys iam building a 450 size quad with 15 amp esc and 3s 2600 mah 25c lipo with turnigy d2822 14 1450 kv motor i want to know if i can use 10*4.5 prop

Would these products be compaitible with each other?
https://robu.in/product/emax-simon-k-series-multirotor-30a-brushless-esc-original/
https://robu.in/product/q450-quadcopter-frame/
https://robu.in/product/emax-mt2216-810kv-bldc-motor-cw-prop1045-combo-original/
https://robu.in/product/orange-5200mah-3s-40c80c-lithium-polymer-battery-pack-lipo/
https://robu.in/product/flysky-fs-i6-2-4g-6ch-ppm-rc-transmitter-fs-ia6b-receiver/

Yes, those products are compatible with each other but you could get better products at better prices if you choose different resellers.

I would prefer buying this motor. It's much more efficient and powerful at a cheaper price.
https://rcmumbai.com/multi-rotors-parts/motors-accessories/rcmumbai-ax-2810q-750kv-brushless-quadcopter-motor.html (https://rcmumbai.com/multi-rotors-parts/motors-accessories/rcmumbai-ax-2810q-750kv-brushless-quadcopter-motor.html)

For the radio I recommend you check the RCI for sale section. I am sure you can find a better radio for a better price.

SimonK firmware is outdated. I recommend you look for BLHeli escs.

All the best
Nietsh.

https://youtu.be/5vgx6mn_VVc