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« on: October 17, 2011, 07:08:00 PM »
flytrack
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During the National aeromodeling meet at Karnal on the 19th/20th.Nov.2011, It is proposed to moot the idea of forming an all India Federation of Aeromodelers which will include the club secretaries/resellers/dealers and prominent aeromodelers to deliberate upon the formation of a single national body to represent the broader interest of all aeromodelers in the country concerning current and future issues with the Govt.bodies and the public perception of the hobby.

If you are unable to attend please feel free to send your opinion problems to the president@amai.in ,so your point of view can be kept in mind-the greater and broader involvement will help formulate a good preamble for the Federation in support of the hobby.Your participation is important to the future of the hobby.
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« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2011, 08:58:18 PM »
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appreciate this step sir...!
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« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2011, 10:49:40 PM »
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« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2011, 10:52:15 PM »
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During the National aeromodeling meet at Karnal on the 19th/20th.Nov.2011, It is proposed to moot the idea of forming an all India Federation of Aeromodelers which will include the club secretaries/resellers/dealers and prominent aeromodelers to deliberate upon the formation of a single national body to represent the broader interest of all aeromodelers in the country concerning current and future issues with the Govt.bodies and the public perception of the hobby.

basic question?
how different will this be from the existing role of AMAI?...

regards
sujju
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« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2011, 07:59:40 AM »
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the federation will include representatives from all clubs /associations and dealers/resellers and prominent aeromodelers to form a platform to deliberate upon issues and work at solutions-AMA will be a part of it as also wings India and others.

This would make them all feel part of a decision making body and strengthen the cause of AMA and the fraternity,we will get a more balanced approach.

Opinions on alternate paths to the same objective are welcome.

How it should be structured,members by election/selection/tenure of members/location of headquarters/scope of activity etc are the initial process of foundation to begin with and we grow from there.

The purpose of putting it on this forum is to solicit views on the subject.

So give us your feed back-it is valuable to the community of aeromodelers. 
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« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2011, 09:02:09 AM »
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sir,
    first I thank and congratulate you for doing this.If you could elaborate the benefits to the modellers I would thankful ofcourse you must have put it already but persons like me who are not really computer savvy it is difficult hence this request.
     Also please tell us how much will be the outgoing per year for a modeller.
wishing you success in this endaevor which will benefit modellers like me
    thanks,
            HH narayanrao KNS
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« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2011, 09:25:20 AM »
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« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2011, 09:34:16 AM »
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It costs nothing to be an active participant and give your views,it is your option.

Let the aeromodelers take the initiative to make the hobby safe and structured.

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« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2011, 09:21:15 PM »
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basic question?
how different will this be from the existing role of AMAI?...
regards
sujju

Since AMAI is going no where - seems like an effort to give it a new life under a different avatar!!!!!!! And may be collect some more funds ;-)
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« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2011, 07:48:40 AM »
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AMA is progressing well ,this proposal comes from other clubs and senior flyers,and AMA would be a constructive partner.
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« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2011, 09:24:49 AM »
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sir,
I am new on this forum and from reading the posts it looks like many are not in favour of Federation Or AMAI  May I get enough information to form a opinion for myself And Why is this Safety concern . Are many Aeromodellers not responsible / Irresponsible persons.  I do not think so I believe that Aeromodeling being a difficult hobby if you really go deep in to it Allmost all Aeromodellers are wise, down to earth and very responsible people and are a very helping lot among other things.
Lte me know others views to form my opinion
   HH Narayanrao KNS
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« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2011, 02:51:37 PM »
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Seems a good idea but I think the more important need will be to set up a task force to spread the hobby and come up with Ideas to do so rather that trying to form various layers with  similar functions .

Nagar Sir , I think it would make more sense to find ways to grow the number of members than trying to organize existing ones . In my opinion those existing aero modelers  who intended to become members   would have done so already and those who have not till now are unlikely to do so . Each has their reasons either way  and skeptics and critics are entitled to their points of view as well.
So I personally  would welcome setting up of this federation  if it is tasked with the mandate to enhance its membership base through innovative out of the box means rather than  being Old wine in new bottle.

Sai
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« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2011, 04:20:09 PM »
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Many share the views of HH,yes we are responsible and intelligent people,the major issues why the subject of AMA or federation is important are:

1.Indiscriminate ownership of transmitters (of all frequencies)-a grave public risk in the eyes of the security.

2.Model aircraft can cause damage to person or property.

What we(aeromodelers) are being asked is.:-

1.Do you have a record of transmitter owners used for aeromodeling?

2.In case of damage to person or property,is there an insurance cover?

We are saying-one should join AMA or similar club and the club should become a member of the federation if formed,so the aeromodeler becomes a recorded and known entity.

The clubs have the discretion of joining the federation if they feel that it helps them address larger and common interest of the community to the authorities.

Aeromodeling is growing at a good pace ,let us take the initiative to self regulate so we can may be considered worthy of a decision making process when the govt.authorities want to bring it under their ambit.

I am not aware of what percentage of aeromodelers in India read this forum ,this is a larger debate-does it favour us?or it binds us ?
is it useful in the long ?should we continue the way we are doing today -do we need to change? and so on and so forth-think!!
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« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2011, 04:32:26 PM »
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This is actually hilarious. So a flier will need to be member of a local club, then AMA and then this Federation ?

All that is said above was the role of AMA, which seems to have failed in their efforts to unite and bring the various RC clubs in India.

I think they lost their steam after the first couple of months wherein they got N.Delhi members and some others from Punjab/Haryana.

<Quote>
the federation will include representatives from all clubs /associations and dealers/resellers and prominent aeromodelers to form a platform to deliberate upon issues and work at solutions-AMA will be a part of it as also wings India and others.
</Quote>
This is exactly what AMA-I had planned to do !

Looks like its acknowledged that they failed to do that, and that AMA is a N.Delhi centric club only. Thus need another umbrella body.

Well Well Well. I guess it would be good if instead of forming all these clubs people put in their energies to actual building/flying and enjoy that, rather than the club-politics.

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« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2011, 04:34:06 PM »
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The clubs have the discretion of joining the federation if they feel that it helps them address larger and common interest of the community to the authorities.

Nice. So clubs pay fee to BOTH AMA and this federation ? Isnt safety the prime concern of AMA ? Or do you accept in writing that its failed to do that, thus we need another body ?
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« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2011, 09:20:44 AM »
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All of us desire that model airplanes be permitted to continue operating in the national aerospace,however for that are we a cohesive body,working within a defined framework to have details and data available , when confronted by the regulatory authorities?

AMA  is not about individuals and the number of members across the country,it is about protecting our rights to use airspace safely and to guarantee the safe and sound operation of model aircraft in the country,let us collectively prevent model Aviation from being sucked into the black hole of regulation.The time to act is now.

The goal is to bring our small community of aeromodelers together.And thats the spirit we love to hear about.
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« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2011, 09:31:19 AM »
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So if there is AMA taking care of these issues, and bringing the small community of aeromodellers together, why the talk about another federation ?

Isnt AMA capable enough to address the things you yourself say above ?
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« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2011, 11:29:52 AM »
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« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2011, 12:42:24 PM »
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   I agree with flyingboxcar. Why so many organisations telling us to do this and do that we are doing responsible modelling for years without any issue. It looks like creating a Authority for benefit of few
     HH narayanrao KNS
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« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2011, 06:18:26 PM »
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My Rejoinder.
I have voiced it in not so many words earlier as well

1.Indiscriminate ownership of transmitters (of all frequencies)-a grave public risk in the eyes of the security.

all FM guys are careful at the field, lest they have a lock out. all small toys (including some of the toy helicopter sold by Heliflier) is 2.4 G Hz, lot of non RC Stuff are 2.4 G Hz. It is a commercially cleared frequency in India, What discrimination can we enforce, I remember when i was a small boy , my father had a big valve based radio and he had a license for it, he used to visit closest wireless office once in a while and buy a Revenue stamp looking ticket and stick it on the passport looking license book, is that what we are talking about ? i really wonder how will this body enforce apartheid on RC community, if possible could it be elaborated,  please.

2.Model aircraft can cause damage to person or property.

It is a statutory warning (Like the one on the cigarette box) that is there on all aeromodel related eqpt (on , Engine, models, motor, etc , sometimes in English, sometimes in Chinglish). What can this body do to minimise that risk all across the country. ? By being Restrictive ?

1.Do you have a record of transmitter owners used for aeromodeling?

Is it Humanly possible ? does anyone know the volume of toys with remotes being dumped into India everyday ? all frequencies ? can this body record Tx being dumped into India in a day, or is it that only Futaba 14 MZs and above will be kept a record of ?

2.In case of damage to person or property,is there an insurance cover?

and the model ? person or property is covered by normal insurance why RC insurance, if anything it should be for the model and the radio. if it is so, it will be too good to be true,

We are saying-one should join AMA or similar club and the club should become a member of the federation if formed,so the aeromodeler becomes a recorded and known entity.

The clubs have the discretion of joining the federation if they feel that it helps them address larger and common interest of the community to the authorities.


Should ? and discretion ? contradictory ? no ? a club which does not join will be an independent unrecorded body so will their members. is the purpose solved ?

...when the govt.authorities want to bring it under their ambit.

This is inevitable, sooner or later it will happen. when it does, it is out of the reach of many who are working on a shoe string budget. a free spirit will still find a way to fly, if not in a aeroplane , outside it. federation or no federation.

In fact federation will be engaged in petty politics when the axe comes down, it is mass movement from  free spirits through forums like this that will / can make a difference.

..we are responsible and intelligent people,

having said this, in the subsequent lines, sir, you somewhat questioned the very existence of it.

my rebuttal sir, in an attempt to see the other side of the coin.

PS
then there are free spirits like us, who enjoy long Runways , unrestricted air space and peace of mind to fly.

PPS
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Re: Aeromodeling Federation
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« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2011, 02:28:57 AM »
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+1 augustin.

North block tells south and east are not structured, and south and east always avoid (hate?) north lobby... bla bla.... bla....   --there is no end of this leg pooling, gauravang.

But here we have united to share experience to minimise expenditure. Though fedaration needs funding, I always prefer Donation rather than fixed contribution as major part of modellers here works on thin budget and they cannot spend like other prefessionals.

At least i will not join rather than back old day free flight gliders.
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« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2011, 09:50:23 AM »
HHnarayanrao
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   Augustinev,
          I entirely in agreement with you sir,In fact I am happy someone is able to say in that many words what I wanted to say,Thanks
          I know a couple of modellers who own fields which are more than 150 acres in size and are their personal property There so many have their friends fly models If restriction on hobby comes i will use some friends to allow me to fly with them as it is I am not into Giant planes.
          Thank you Mr Augustinev for your views
    HH Narayanrao KNS
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« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2011, 11:52:07 AM »
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good to see some people sending in their responses,are you aware how the following affect our activity:

in the US:FAA,AMA,FCC

in the UK:CAA,BMFA(bmfa.org),RAC

do take some time to go through bmfa.org and learn about the elements involved ,we could take some clues from these.

and so on in many countries in the world,What is FAI ,its role in aerosports?
What is ACI,why should it be a member of FAI?

Read about these organisations and see how they are structured towards aeromodeling.

a lot us of keep cribbing about WPC control of frequency/import issues -which one of you or which organisation is approaching these agencies with a proper case to represent your cause?

Why not some of you take your time and energy to prepare a proper case/reasoning to support your activity and think beyond yourself and the activity at large and its future-that could be more constructive!

Its not about what a small handful feel or think.
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« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2011, 09:28:51 AM »
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Extract of the letter by Mr.More,chairman Wings-India of Mumbai:

Forwarded hereunder is a news letter Received from Mr. Vijendra Nagar - President Aero Modelers Association (AMA) in regard to the forthcoming Karnal meet being organised by them on the 19-20 Nov. AMA is also an affiliated body of Wings India as well a member of Aero Club Of India.
 
The excellent work being done by Mr. Nagar and his team  is certainly very commendable  and needs all encouragement and support from the entire Aero modelers fraternity of our country. We should participate wholeheartedly and in maximum nos. I know that lot of modelers face problems with the logistics and are reluctant, but I am sure this much perseverance and patience we need to demonstrate for a sport so dear to us. After all we are a small minority in a very large society, and unless we consolidate, our very existence some times is at risk, due to the ignorance and inability of the masses and the media in comprehending the true benefits and the passion of this hobby/sport.
 
I particularly, strongly subscribe, to the idea of forming a 'Indian RC Aeromodelers federation' of all clubs, bodies and association, who may, in any collective way, be contributing to the furtherance of this sport. Such a federation could then act as a effective platform to address the misconceptions and genuine greiviences of our community with the government authorities and the administrative arm. We stand a much better chance of being heard if we stand joinly.
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« Reply #24 on: October 26, 2011, 01:49:28 PM »
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   So mote it be
    HH n KNS
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