RC India

hey fellows,

i want to paint camo on my depron foamies...i tried it one of the Fevicryl sprays but it ate away the foam totally... :( :( :( had to make the whole wing again :banghead: :banghead:
please help me out..any idea which spray can can i use??..moreover any idea about air-brush/spray availability here in India??

Rgds
YD

Try using the Fevicryl fabric paint using a airbrush or a home made spray using the legendary "flit"
the small pump which was mostly used to spray cockroach poison, it is still available in some hardware shops.
Don't know what the outsome of the home made spray would be but we used to paint bicycles with this method.
hope atleast something helps.

-Dorwin

thanks...by the way i tried using the spray/sprinkler used by barbers....it didnt work...will try using the legendary "flit"...
cheers.. :salute:

rgds
YD

Hey YD!
let us know if it works, but make sure..fabric paint, Its water proof, and gives a better rubbery, epoxy kinda finish..

@Controlflyer  ya sure...
i think that was the mistake i was making...i was using normal paint with that barber sprayer...will try with fabric paint...
thanks again man...

Rgds
YD

Fevicryl Poster and Fabric (Acrylic) colors are foam safe and the later one give a nice gloss finish as well.

using a paint brush is almost useless for non-fine art person like me. you get small 'Tattoo' Airbrush set at decent Tool/Machinery stores for as less Rs 800-1200. You would need to buy an Air Compressor pump(a costly and rare item) or use compressed air cans which are mush economical.  this pump issue is holding me long from going for an Air brush set.
 
I have been contemplating for this Air pump issue and thinking of using old Jeep tubes. you can get them for as less as Rs 500-100. Go to nearby Puncture  repair guy and get it filled for Rs 2. Any body tried that ? Would the pressure be enough ?

I think this issue has been thrashed, in a thread by Sundaramvelar, some time ago.

http://www.rcindia.org/electric-planes/depron-mig-29-(fulcrum)-build-from-plan/

Thats an ingenious idea... While I do not know if that can work or not, may be VC can answer better since he has tried it.

As regards the pressure, the pilot spray guns mentioned by VC elsewhere require 1 Kg / cm2 pressure.  The tyre tubes normally are filled to 28~30 psi (normal tyre pressure for cars) which would be 1.9~2.1 kg/cm2 and i think should be enough.

People have tried all kind of things to skirt the expenses involved in buying a compressor. Tyre tubes, Hazzak lantern bases, Refilling old deo cans with air after fitting a cycle valve at the base and welding it. The results vary.

I personally went into a lot of detail and picked up a refrigerator coolant tank and fashioned the valves. yet to test it completely.

Hi everybody,
Any idea about this
http://cgi.ebay.in/PORTABLE-CAR-AIR-COMPRESSOR-FLAT-TYRES-FREE-GIFT-/360301851773?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_203&hash=item53e3a9f47d#ht_4840wt_981

(http://65.98.88.50/~searchbi/Air_compressor_FX_303.jpg)

I have given thought about the Car Air Pump long time back. Was waiting for some other member to test the waters.

As far as the Airbrush goes, I have decent decent Airbrush, like ones from Pilotindia, in machine tool shops in SP Road Bangalore for Rs 800-1200 only. One should find them in similar tool markets in other major cities.

The Air compressor mentioned above, though looks real very professional seems costly for Rs 500 I guess. Gaurav from Allahabad was selling a more practical compressor from Testers (tower hobbies ) for 1700, good price but it worked on 110v AC.
http://www.rcindia.org/for-sale/portable-air-compressor-(testors)-for-rs-1000/
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXDEF4&P=ML

Even Rotor has few Air compressors: (Are they for Air brush)
http://www.rotor.co.in/prod-list.asp?catid={7062A736-926F-47E1-ACE8-F39BF67E6030}

Hobby King has a clone of the Testers compressor for $31 + $30 Shipping to India(2.5KG)  
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9298&Product_Name=Mini_Air_Compressor_(1/8hp)_220-240v

I would be delighted if the Rs 600 worth tires compressor works with Air Brush.

Those tyre compressors make a racket. Also the output is pulsed which won't suit an airbrush. If you have a big tank, to average out the pulses, it might work. But the sound is a real turn off. They also overheat pretty fast. I had one which gave up its life too soon. Something blew off, I haven't yet opened it up to see what gave way.

The tyre as storage might sound like a good idea, but the volume is really low. Beginners will waste a lot of air and the air will run out in no time.

I had posted a link to the tyre compressor long ago in the thread of Sundaramvelar. I have used it to charge a compressed air tank which is available at any refrigerant parts shop. The air has to be pumped in and stored in the tank which is fitted with a pressure gauge. Once the desired pressure is achieved in the tank, the inlet valve is shut off and the outlet valve to the airbrush is opened.

Commence spraying. Once the pressure drops, reverse the process. Switch off the outlet valve, switch open the inlet valve and switch on the compressor. In this system, the only flaw is that you need to fine tune it a lot at the beginning, thats where I lost patience. All my stuff is neatly packed away as we are about to shift residence. Therefore I can't post the pictures of my setup.

Simpler method is to connect the compressor directly to the airbrush. The pressure will build inside the pipe and you can paint in short bursts. Zap, zap, zap - allow pressure to build, zap, zap, zap, allow pressure to build, zap, zap, zap....!  ;D

However, if you don't time it to perfection, the pipe will blow out off the airbrush or the compressor end!  :giggle: With a bit of practice and concentration, this system can be used for painting smaller models.

For fabric paint, what kind of medium is used? or directly using fabric paint. Today I have seen the  "Camel" and "Faber - Castell" brands, which says, "can be used directly"! does it means, medium is not mandatory?

May be a funny question, can we use "water" as medium for fabric paint?  :giggle:

Dileep

There is a medium available for fabric paint. Its a white liquid sold in well stocked art shops. Check in a LandMark shop near your place. I've seen it in Bangalore at least.

Air brush compressors are mostly diaphragm pumps and not piston pumps. That is why they are noiseless and have a even pressure. Further they have a pressure sensitive cut out switch which switches on and off the pump as and when it is being used.

Similar diaphragm air pumps are Aquarium air pumps. High capacity good quality aquarium pumps deliver good volume of air and at good pressure ( Not the cheaper home aquarium pumps but the one used for large and deep aquariums). They are available for about Rs 1000/-. Has any one tried them for spray painting?

One more silent air pump available for about Rs 1500 is Nebulizer air pumps used for treating Asthma patients which delivers good volume of air at good pressure. Has any one tried this?

Water works.


How much pressure do these develop ? Their intended use doesn't require high pressure, hence the question.

Also which brand nebulizer did you find for 1500 ? I had a one time need for it once in the family, but the prices I got was near 3000. Might consider getting one if it is cheaper.

My Bad Nebuliser which I saw was for Rs 1850/- not Rs 1500/-

http://cgi.ebay.in/OMRON-Compressor-Nebulizer-NE-C25-Air-Nebuliser-Warnty-/310252426504?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_203&hash=item483c7c5508#ht_2721wt_911

Aquarium pumps do not have equivalent pressure as an airbrush compressor, however high capacity air pumps do have sufficient pressure to push down water column of 1.5-2 Mtrs and further deliver air bubbles inside the aquarium. Exact pressure I will have to measure. Was just trying to see if someone has attempted this Modification.

http://cgi.ebay.in/Boyu-Four-Outlet-Air-Pump-S-4000B-/270633339129?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_203&hash=item3f030108f9#ht_813wt_911

Theoretically they don't seem to be suitable airbrushing. The nebulizer has max pressure of 29psi. While you could paint with thin paints at lower pressures, there is not much head room. Another important issue is the airflow rate, 9lpm is too low.

A water column of over 20m corresponds to 30psi according to http://www.onlineconversion.com/pressure.htm. Also I don't think the airflow will be enough. So looks like aquarium pumps are out of contention.

I think you may be right about both. I have no way of testing a Nebulizer with the airbrush. However I am planning to test the air brush with aquarium pumps will post the results. Anyone having the nebuliser can do the same and post the results if possible.

Why this hunch with me is that when I am painting with aircompressor meant for air brush, the air brush continues to paint even after the pressure has fallen down from its max set from 40 psi to I think about 20 when you are operating with paint which has sufficient viscosity. Therefore If it is able to paint with much lower pressure with paint thinned down then it should serve the purpose marginally.

An important question here is, what is the ideal pressure for spray painting...

From one of the other forums that I see for my static models,

QUOTE
15-25 psi is best for most situations.

Other than that, the best advise is "practice practice practice"
UNQUOTE

If that is the case, the aquarium pump (big ones) or the nebuliser pumps could be enough.

The link to above quote is
http://cs.finescale.com/FSMCS/forums/p/109663/1088356.aspx#1088356

You need to look at psi + airflow rate. You could fill up a tank with a low airflow compressor and then start painting. But it will drain out very fast unless you have a huge reservoir. It is recommended to keep the airflow on when you paint, so you use up air pretty fast. If you have to take long breaks frequently to let the tank fill up, it is frustrating.

Bought an acrylic spray paint from G.C Laha today, the brand is Arfina and it is marketed by Camlin. The bottle says that it is suitable for use with thermocol and so did the salesman. Tried on a small piece of biofoam, it ate it completely, lucky that i didn't try it on my model. Full Rs 190 wasted. Will go tomorrow and will buy Acrylic fabric paint, hopefully that will work.

Just want to know how the finish would be if i use a paintbrush for painting?

Does anyone here knows a foam safe spray paint available in India?

How do i paint on sanded depron without using air brush?

I bought Camlin poster paints today. Each bottle contains 30ml of paint. Wanted to know how much water has to be mixed with that?

And Anyone with answers to my previous question?

Someone at our field used ordinary "permanent markers" to great effect.  Will try to snap some pictures next time.

Has anybody tried painting using the domestic vacuum cleaner. The vacuum cleaner also comes with an attachment to spray liquid.

Shreekant

Yes, i am gonna use my vacuum cleaner. I just want to know the correct proportion of water to poster paint.

I have done a trial by spraying water to my plants before using paint. It works great. You just put a thumb over a small hole on the top and the water or paint sprays out and if you remove your thumb it doesn't spray out.

The vacuum cleaner is Euroclean X force http://www.eurekaforbes.com/vacuum-cleaners/euroclean-xforce.aspx

canned spray paints work best for me. took 2mins to colour my 36" span flying"wing" ;D

But Rs:350 per can :'(

What is the name of the paint and the brand? I bought canned spray paint here but it ate the foam totally.

Let me share my "desi" method of spray painting without pressurized cans / vacuum cleaner  ;D

You will need the following:
- A regular toothbrush (does not have to be new)
- Some fabric / acrylic paint
- Cup of water
- Cello tape
- Knife / Scissor
- Stencil of the design you want on your plane on a heavy stock paper

The Process:
First, create a stencil for the design on heavy paper (card stock) and cut-out the parts that you want painted on the plane using a knife/scissor (Alphabet and other simple design stencils are available in stationary stores). 
Next, lay your stencil design on top of the plane (let's say wing) and tape the four corners with some cello-tape (we want temporary adhesion).
Third, take the toothbrush and soak it in water and then dip it in the paint of your choice (we don't want too much water, but initially the tooth brush has to be soaked in water). Now hold the paint dipped toothbrush between your thumb & index finger over the design and gently rub your thumb over the bristles of the tooth brush.
Lastly, repeat this process a few times and you will see a smooth/even spay design of the stencil pattern. Now let the paint dry and remove the cello-tape to reveal the actual design painted on the wings.

Word of advice:
Please practice this on some sample area before painting on your precious plane.

Can use those sketch pen blowers that sell for Rs.30/- Its a very simple blower - tube inside which you keep the sketch pen and then blow into the tube from the other end. You get a nice spray paint effect. Very easy and simple.

Its called 'RUST-OLEUM' specialty, flourescent spray paint. You got to hold the can 12" away from the target area & spray the MIST only..DO NOT allow the paint to drip on to the foam, as prolonged spraying (keeping the cap pressed for a long duration)will cause liquid to drip from the nozzel and it will eat into the foam!! One mistake we tend to make is that the cans are not shaken properly. Good amount of pressure has to be maintained in the can.

Good idea there Ritesh bhaiya but the point is that with that method I will not be able to paint the whole plane because it is too cumbersome.

I have decided to use fabric/acrylic paint with the vacuum cleaner, because i am really impressed with the outcome. Now, the last bit to know is what proportion of water and poster or fabric/acrylic paint is normally used?

How do i know that i have mixed too much water or too less? 

Anyone with the answer to the above question?

Alright, went to Starmark today and found the 100ml tubes of Raphael Acrylic colours http://www.raphael.fr/en/catalog/colors/color_acrylic.php . Each tube costs Rs 190. I wanted to confirm whether this can be used on foam, so tried to read what was written on the back of the tube, but it was all "greek" to me, continued reading and realized that it was "made in france", so it must have been "french". I didn't buy it. 

Anyhow, i asked the salesman and as expected he had no idea. So, now I ask the forum members, please refer to the site above and tell me whether this is foam-safe or not?

Shaking the can is required to mix the paint/solvent thoroughly.There is usually a ball inside that helps in this.  The pressure is purely from the propellant.

Rohit,
What you need to know is whether these have any solvents and what is that solvent. Generally words like toluene or similar would be spelt similar in all langauges. So as long as the script is Roman it should not pose any problems.
If it is in Cyrillic or other it would be pretty difficult to make out.

Other practical way is to buy tube/can and try it out on scrap piece to check suitability. This also gives you idea on coverage, colour depth etc and another tip is always start painting on the bottom/less visible area so that if you have any issues it would be easy to conceal  

And my research on the Raphael site indicates that the acrylic colours from the firm are water soluble. Therefore I am more or less convinced that these would be foam safe, but still a good idea to test on scrap piece before putting it on your pride and joy

With regards to post #1, be warned, the method of using your household vaccum cleaner would work perfectly if you want to paint your house/wall on a model it would make sure to leave a heavy coat of paint which might weigh in as much as your model itself, and you certainly do not want that.
Ask me how I know that  :banghead:

Ok so found this on their website. Hope this gives a clearer picture of whether this could be used on foam.


"
Bright intense acrylic colour that dries to a satin finish. Large colour palette for great possibilities of colour mixing. Buttery oilpaint like texture, not too fluid, not too thick. High covering and colour power due to the quality and concentration of pigments.
Dries to a non-yellowing, non-resoluble, waterproof paint film. Colours are opaque and lightfast. Easy to use and manipulate
with brush or palette knife. Full body. Able to maintain impasto brushmarks and palette marks when dry. Will not crack when
dry. Apply on various non-greasy (preferably rigid) surfaces: paper, canvas, cardboard, wood, fabric… Dilute with Raphael
Gloss Medium for washes on sealed surface, such as gessoed canvas. Dilute with water for even washes on absorbent surface
such as paper. Able to be used for a wide variety of techniques and mixed media applications, such as collage, overlaying
colour, mixing with aggregates such as sand…"

So please anyone?

Rohit
I have used acrylic on depron and on Parkmaster they are fine, water based colour too ain't bad, used those too (Parkmaster Canopy)

I have used fevicryll on foam. Another thing one can do is to apply a coat or two of WBPU before painting.

Thanks everyone.